O2 sensor alert to catalytic converter failure [Archive] - Honda Ridgeline Owners Club Forums

: O2 sensor alert to catalytic converter failure


amy19355
11-03-2009, 09:20 AM
My Honda dealer is telling me that the catalytic converter needs to be replaced at 81,000 miles.

I don't understand why the O2 sensor did not fail first.

The dealer says the O2 sensors are fine.

$1000+ to repair - but i'm going to another dealer for a 2nd opinion.

input from you folks is appreciated.
thanks
Amy

chisoxjim
11-03-2009, 09:22 AM
my dealer told me my cat failed about 100,000 miles ago, didnt get it replaced, all is good.

Mr Bigs
11-03-2009, 09:53 AM
my dealer told me my cat failed about 100,000 miles ago, didnt get it replaced, all is good.Isn't it under warranty till 100K ?

chisoxjim
11-03-2009, 10:05 AM
Isn't it under warranty till 100K ?

correction.... looked back at my post(miles run together),it was about 60,000 miles ago. Mine was at 130,000 when this happened....

YMMV

shovelhd
11-03-2009, 11:19 AM
Isn't it under warranty till 100K ?

8/80 on cats, at least on my 2006. At 81K, Amy, you should ask your Honda dealer to contact Honda and see if they will help you with a goodwill repair.

Whaleya
11-04-2009, 07:12 AM
Why did you bring it in and why did the dealer say it was the cat?

Had you been running with a check engine light for a long time? In which case the cat could have cooked if you were running rich.

I agree a second opinion is good, as is replacing the O2 sensors.

_W

xkutax
04-29-2011, 08:23 PM
Isn't it under warranty till 100K ?

I went to have routine 100,000 mile maintenance done on my car and im only at 98,000 miles. with in 3 days of spending $1366.46 for that. car has been misfiring, so another honda replaced my coils saying that there was nothing that
the first honda company did that was wrong, so that cost me another $224.56. Now a week later my check engine light comes on and they are telling me that it is my catalytic converter failure. saying that it is blocked. and that it is going to cost me another $1000.00 + to fix. I don't have this type of money. Mhy car was running perfactly fine until i got the stupid maintenance done. It almost makes me want to not do maintence except oil changes. They have sucked already close to 2000.00. Each problem doesn't have anything to so with the original fix. This must be a honda issue that they are not telling anyone about just to suck more money out of us... Oh and the mileage question. I was told 8 yrs or 80,000 miles.

Goodview
04-29-2011, 09:52 PM
Do your homework, determine the cat's actual input and output temperatures, then swap the secondary O2 sensors to determine for sure whether they (the sensors) are bad. Laser thermometers cost less than $50 and you can use them on lots of fun projects.

The Ridgeline's computer only comes up with a conclusion based on the input from the sensors, not the cat's actual (non) function.

Search is your friend.

'100 degrees honda catalytic' are good keywords for Google.

:act014:

laserguy
04-30-2011, 09:41 AM
catalytic converters are being stolen from cars for cash these days, just for the value of the metals inside, I would not be surprised shops can make a good profit selling new ones and getting cash for the old ones, up to $100.00 cash just for the metal inside some.

trizo123
07-29-2011, 07:22 PM
I have had my engine light come off and on for 2 years now. usually only comes on in the winter and the code is for the cat being clogged.. since its been warm out it hasnt come back on in the last few months.

interpon
07-29-2011, 07:41 PM
Crooks..
Go to autozone or equivelant. Have tem check code and reset it...
My goodyear guy told me resetand forget and swears honda has timers on o2 sensors.. And if bad muffler shop will replace for less than half... Much less

NetDoc
07-29-2011, 09:31 PM
My cat has been plugged since it hit 90K. I have 183K on it now, with an engine light that stays on. A really plugged cat will suck the power out of an engine at higher speeds. Think of it as an exhaust restriction. I am not experiencing ANY signs of a blocked restriction, do the check engine stays on. You still can't feel or hear the engine running at idle.

Goodview
07-30-2011, 12:18 PM
My cat has been plugged since it hit 90K. I have 183K on it now, with an engine light that stays on. A really plugged cat will suck the power out of an engine at higher speeds. Think of it as an exhaust restriction. I am not experiencing ANY signs of a blocked restriction, do the check engine stays on. You still can't feel or hear the engine running at idle.

So, why do you say you have a plugged cat? OBDII only reports what is (thinks it) sees. It uses the input from the O2 sensors and comes up with the CODE. The CODE doesn't MEAN you have a dead / plugged cat.

Have you checked your temperatures ? It takes ten minutes.

Quote from another thread:
...Do your homework, determine the cat's actual input and output temperatures, then swap the secondary O2 sensors to determine for sure whether they (the sensors) are bad. Laser thermometers cost less than $50 and you can use them on lots of fun projects.

The Ridgeline's computer only comes up with a conclusion based on the input from the sensors, not the cat's actual (non) function.

Search is your friend. '100 degrees honda catalytic' are good keywords for Google.

Do that search and you'll find the actual links to HONDA TSB's about Ridgeline cats.

:act018:

Alaskanyukon
07-31-2011, 08:37 PM
If has PO420 (Catalyst Efficiency Below Threshold) code may need replacement but .....

zroger73
07-31-2011, 09:42 PM
Unlike the pre-cat O2 sensor which is used to calculate actual air/fuel ratio, the post-cat O2 sensor is monitored for a rising/falling signal that is used to determine cat health. If the cat is doing its job, the signal will lag behind the pre-cat sensor at a slower rate. If the signal remains steady or rises/falls as quickly as the pre-cat sensor, the computer determines the cat is no longer doing its job. The sensor itself is also monitored for opens, shorts, or performance problems. There are different codes for various sensor and cat problems, but the most common is the "P0420 Catalyst Below Threshold Efficiency" as previously mentioned. This usually means it's time to replace the cat.

blueridge11
12-13-2011, 09:42 AM
I have had my engine light come off and on for 2 years now. usually only comes on in the winter and the code is for the cat being clogged.. since its been warm out it hasnt come back on in the last few months.

Sorry for digging up an old thread, but the above statement is exactly what has happebned with my Ridgeline. I got the check engine light last winter. The code called out bank1 of the CAT. I ordered my own O2 sensors, but before I could replace them the engine light went away and didn't come back until now. Both times the light came on right after the weather turned cold. Does anyone know what might cause this?

My Ridgeline runs OK. The gas mileage is down from about 18.5 to 17.0mpg. It seems to have normal power. Occasionally I smell gas or exhaust fumes. Not sure I'm ready to hand $2000+ to a dealer for this.

blueridge11
12-20-2011, 04:33 PM
Anybody have some idea about winter gas/cold weather causing a bank 1 cat code?

Monica6128
01-23-2012, 12:58 PM
Seems like a common problem...I at least feel better reading this thread.

Basically, my check engine light came on about 2 days after Xmas. My husband is a auto body repairman, so he used his shops OBDII reader to pull the code: P0420. We saved up the money to replace all 4 O2 sensors & the catalytic converter. Planned on ordering all of the parts through his work today (he gets a little discount)...and my check engine light just went off on it's own Saturday evening - 3 weeks after being on constantly. Weather was a bit warmer than it has been I guess...in the mid-50's as opposed to 30's-40's over the past few weeks. Other than that nothing has changed. The light was on for almost a month and then just turned off...

We are still going to replace the O2 sensors because it is recommended that they be replaced on OBDII vehicles every 100,000 miles (I am at 112K). Luckily we hadn't spent $250 on a new Cat that we didn't need...or maybe the light will return when the temp's drop back down. Who knows? I know that a failing sensor can throw false codes...and can not throw codes also, so once we get the new sensors in this week maybe we'll get the code again...or maybe not.

carolinaridgeline
01-24-2012, 01:32 AM
Thank you for sharing Monica,

Can you share the part numbers for CAT and senors?

Can anyone tell where the CAT is located for Bank 1?

Thanks





Seems like a common problem...I at least feel better reading this thread.

Basically, my check engine light came on about 2 days after Xmas. My husband is a auto body repairman, so he used his shops OBDII reader to pull the code: P0420. We saved up the money to replace all 4 O2 sensors & the catalytic converter. Planned on ordering all of the parts through his work today (he gets a little discount)...and my check engine light just went off on it's own Saturday evening - 3 weeks after being on constantly. Weather was a bit warmer than it has been I guess...in the mid-50's as opposed to 30's-40's over the past few weeks. Other than that nothing has changed. The light was on for almost a month and then just turned off...

We are still going to replace the O2 sensors because it is recommended that they be replaced on OBDII vehicles every 100,000 miles (I am at 112K). Luckily we hadn't spent $250 on a new Cat that we didn't need...or maybe the light will return when the temp's drop back down. Who knows? I know that a failing sensor can throw false codes...and can not throw codes also, so once we get the new sensors in this week maybe we'll get the code again...or maybe not.

R3SP0NSE
12-10-2012, 02:08 PM
Hey everyone,

I'm currently experiencing this check engine issue, has there been a fix figured out? I, for one, can't just ignore the light, it drives me nuts. I want it fixed and by reading the posts, it seems that a few people live with it, and others have tried O2 sensors.

What's the actual fix? I'd like to get a new cat if that's what it takes. But I want to know for sure. My latest error code was as follows

P0420 - CATALYST B1 EFFICIENCY BELOW THRESHOLD

Thanks in advance!

beatleknight
12-30-2012, 01:13 PM
Hey everyone,

I'm currently experiencing this check engine issue, has there been a fix figured out? I, for one, can't just ignore the light, it drives me nuts. I want it fixed and by reading the posts, it seems that a few people live with it, and others have tried O2 sensors.

What's the actual fix? I'd like to get a new cat if that's what it takes. But I want to know for sure. My latest error code was as follows

P0420 - CATALYST B1 EFFICIENCY BELOW THRESHOLD

Thanks in advance!
Lots of opinions but no definite answer. I too have the dreaded P0420 code at 71k miles. Guess I'll have to take it in to the dealer for a diagnostic. If its the cat itself then it should be free. Otherwise who knows which O2 sensor it could be and how much it could cost. We'll see.

carolinaridgeline
12-30-2012, 01:55 PM
Lots of opinions but no definite answer. I too have the dreaded P0420 code at 71k miles. Guess I'll have to take it in to the dealer for a diagnostic. If its the cat itself then it should be free. Otherwise who knows which O2 sensor it could be and how much it could cost. We'll see.

I get the same code at 155,600 miles on my 06. P0420 code, Bank one. I just hook up my ODBII scanner and erase code. Happens about every 1000 miles. Let us know what you find out Beatlenight.

Silver 3.5
12-30-2012, 06:49 PM
A firend has an 06 Ridgeline and about 140K miles. He just got this code and I pulled it with my scan tool. Same P0420 code but...

1) Post cat O2 sensors are reading consistently flat lean condition indicating that the cats are doing their job.
2) Pre cat sensor on one of the banks looks a little lazy compared to the other one and to my Ridgeline.

Could this be an O2 sensor issue??

Jackspt28
01-02-2013, 08:49 AM
Hello, Sorry to hear you are having issues. The P0420 code refers to bank 1 Catalyst which on Honda is The firewall side of the engine. P0430 refers to the Radiator side catalyst.
OEM Catalytic converters should last at least 150,000 miles as long as they have been treated properly. By treated properly I mean that the vehicle has been maintained properly and never had any issues such as a misfire, or any other issues that affect proper air/fuel ratios.
A misfiring engine can ruin a catalytic converter in short time. The excessive emissions (unburned or partially burned fuel) entering the converter can cause the converter to overheat and ruin the precious metal coating in the converter honeycomb (substrate material). Once this happens the converter will become inefficient at proceessing the exhauat gasses.
Any vehicle problem that affects the air /fuel mixture such as MAF sensor issues, 02 sensor faults ,fuel injector problems like dirty injectors, excessive carbon build up on the intake valves and combustion chambers, faulty or lazy O2 sensors, coil problems, and base engine issues such as worn engine components, and oil consumption issues can ruin the converters.
The codes P0420 (bank 1) and P0430 (bank 2) ,simply means that the converters have been deemed inefficient by the vehicles onboard diagnostic monitors.This doesn't necessarily mean the converters are are bad or clogged (although they could be clogged, which would result in a drastic reduction in power and fuel economy and usually will set other fault codes along with the converter codes.).
Very often the upstream O2 sensor is defective, or lazy (slow switching rate). When this happens the computors onboard catalyst monitor precieves the catalyst is inefficient because of the false readings reported by the lazy upstrem O2 sensor. In reality the vehicle may only need an O2 senor for the affected bank of cylinders.The catalyst may be OK.
The Key is in the diagnostics. Simply getting the code read at your local Autozone is not considered proper diagnostics. It simply gives you the area to start the diagnostic routine.
If you have experienced running issues such as a misfire, a faulty sensor like a MAF sensor, O2 sensor, coolant temperature sensor, or intake vacuum leaks etc.in the past 6 months ,the converters may have been damaged and eventually triggered the P0420/P0430 Catalyst efficiency codes.
Have the vehicle diagnosed properly by a trained professional to be sure the converter(s) are the only problem and not the result of another underlying vehicle problem.Testing should include overall engine condition, Fuel trim analysis, converter temperature tests, and O2 sensor evaluation.
Failure to properly repair the root cause of the issue can result in another expensive catalytic converter failure.
I always recommend replacing the O2 sensors on vehicles with more than 80,000 miles,when replacing the catalytic converter (s). Most manufactures recommend O2 sensor replacement at 100K. I also recommend fuel Injector cleaning, and induction system cleaning (motorvac/seaFoam,Etc.) on vehicles with more than 100,000 miles prior to replacing the converter(s).
Good Luck and Happy New Year!

Jack George
Eastern Catalytic Technical Representative

Jackspt28
01-02-2013, 08:53 AM
Honda Ridgeline (2006 model) Rear (firewall side) Catalytic converter image.

xd9x19
01-02-2013, 09:18 AM
My Ridgeline started throwing the P0420 code a month or two ago. So far I've just reset it with my ODBII scanner each time. Usually shows up about once every tank of fuel.

henni
01-02-2013, 11:52 AM
..just reset it with my ODBII scanner each time.

don't forget to rerun ILP since you have also lost the setting(s)

John's Ridge
01-02-2013, 08:17 PM
I had the dealer replace my cat at 67k due to failure (under warranty). They blamed the high moisture content in gas due to ethanol. Made sense. Ethanol is bad news and I am too cheap to pay the extra 20-30 cents/gallon for all gas.:act043:

diggitybiggity
01-07-2013, 04:54 PM
Hi everyone... just got a call from the dealer, the CAT is bad according to them. The truck has LESS than 80k miles on it, just purchased her used a couple months back. How do I know if this is covered under warranty or not? According to most posts in here you're saying if it has less than 80K miles it should be covered, but I see no where in the warranty information that this is the case. I have 100K mile power train warranty and a bumper to bumper 1 year or 7k mile warranty, but in the "Honda Care Warranty Manual" it states that this doesn't cover the CAT. If this is the case I'm going to be seriously annoyed, as I just drove off the lot with this thing less than 3 months ago and haven't even put 1K miles on it.

Any and ALL help/Opinions/Suggestion/Knowledge would be very welcome and helpful

thanks!!

zroger73
01-07-2013, 06:28 PM
Hi everyone... just got a call from the dealer, the CAT is bad according to them. The truck has LESS than 80k miles on it, just purchased her used a couple months back. How do I know if this is covered under warranty or not? According to most posts in here you're saying if it has less than 80K miles it should be covered, but I see no where in the warranty information that this is the case. I have 100K mile power train warranty and a bumper to bumper 1 year or 7k mile warranty, but in the "Honda Care Warranty Manual" it states that this doesn't cover the CAT. If this is the case I'm going to be seriously annoyed, as I just drove off the lot with this thing less than 3 months ago and haven't even put 1K miles on it.

Any and ALL help/Opinions/Suggestion/Knowledge would be very welcome and helpful

thanks!!

Per my 2010 Ridgeline Warranty manual, the catalytic converters are covered by Honda for 8 years or 80,000 miles under both the Federal and California emissions warranties.

diggitybiggity
01-07-2013, 08:17 PM
Thanks!! I found the Federal Guidelines and I'm completely within the window. Now it's just a matter of getting Honda Care to comply with the law... let's hope this is easier than it sounds, I have feeling I'm in for a bit of a fight.

:act043:

djtrades
01-27-2013, 07:15 PM
Just took my '07 in the ther day after the engine warning light went on and stayed on. My local dealer shop told be it was the rear catalyic converter that needs replacemnt and it woul cost aprox. $1500 to replace with labor!
Odometer reads 163,000km.
We just had a winter cold snap and in a couple of days it's supposed to warm back up. Hoping to see if the warning goes away with the weather.

speedlever
01-28-2013, 08:15 AM
Would a reasonable diagnostic routine be to swap the front and rear O2 sensors, reset the codes, and see if the code follows the sensor?

Rats, looking at the parts diagram, the front and rear O2 sensors have different p/n.

From Bernardi:
http://i.imgur.com/HbZJgU4.png