Honda going Diesel, not V8 gas [9.26.06]

[CGM55123]

From the Wall Street Journal

Honda to Pitch Diesel to Americans

Car Maker Plans to Launch
Sedan With 'Clean' Engine
In the U.S. Market by 2009
By NORIHIKO SHIROUZU
September 25, 2006

UTSUNOMIYA, Japan -- Honda Motor Co. is betting a newly developed engine will win over American consumers to diesel-powered vehicles.

The Japanese auto maker announced plans to launch in the U.S. by 2009 a sedan -- probably a Honda Accord -- powered by a "superclean," four-cylinder diesel system. The system consists of a diesel engine Honda has introduced in Europe, plus devices that significantly reduce the polluting gases given off by diesel combustion.

American consumers have long shunned diesel vehicles, and Honda hopes the system will convince them that the technology can be clean and quiet. Diesel vehicles generally achieve about 30% better fuel economy than comparable gasoline-powered cars, and Honda believes they could compete head-on with gasoline-electric hybrid systems at a time when consumers are concerned about high gasoline prices.


"We want to change the image of diesels in the U.S.," Honda's chief executive officer, Takeo Fukui, said in an interview.

He said Honda also is working on a bigger V6 diesel system and will aim to offer diesel engines as fuel-efficient powertrain options in vehicles bigger than the midsize Accord, notably large sport-utility vehicles like the Acura MDX and the Honda Pilot. "Gasoline-electric hybrids work well in small cars," Mr. Fukui said. "But with vehicles bigger than the Accord, we think superclean diesels are a much better way to go."

The new system is based on the 2.2-liter i-CTDi diesel engine that Honda introduced in Europe a few years ago, which emits fewer sooty particulates than previous diesel engines. The system also features an advanced catalytic converter that scrubs nitrogen oxides, known as NOx, given off in the combustion process into harmless nitrogen. High emissions of NOx and sooty particulates have hampered the wider use of diesel engines globally, especially in North America.

Honda said the system, unveiled over the weekend at the company's Tochigi technical center north of Tokyo, is as clean as the most advanced gasoline engines. They expect it to meet the Environmental Protection Agency's tough Tier II Bin 5 diesel-emission regulations, as well as even more-stringent standards for California. That would mean Honda vehicles equipped with the system could be sold in all 50 U.S. states.

Honda said the system sacrifices little horsepower or fuel economy.

U.S. and European auto makers, including General Motors Corp., are taking a different approach to cleaning up harmful diesel emissions. They use urea, an ammonia-based fluid, in a converter to turn NOx emissions into a harmless mix of nitrogen and water.

By contrast, Honda's system uses a newly designed catalytic converter with a two-layer structure. One layer absorbs NOx from the exhaust gas and converts some of it into ammonia. The other layer uses that ammonia in a chemical reaction that turns the remaining NOx into harmless nitrogen.

This means the Honda system doesn't need a big, separate tank for urea, making the system simpler and more compact. In addition, the user won't have to top up the system with urea to make the engine run properly. "Our system is a much more carefree solution for the consumer," said Hiroshi Ohno, the system's chief engineer.

GM plans to introduce super-clean, light-duty diesel trucks in North America some time after 2009, and doesn't think its urea-based NOx treatment system is inferior. The trucks have "a urea tank that is sufficiently large, and the system is optimized in such a way that you only top off the urea when you go in for an oil drain," said Charlie Freese, executive director of GM's diesel engineering. "It doesn't require a lot of user intervention."

Those trucks also will likely come equipped with an indicator on the dashboard that "indicates how much urea you have left, and how much longer you can drive before you need more urea," Mr. Freese said.

The GM trucks also are expected to meet Tier II Bin 5 regulations and go on sale in all 50 states.

[CGM55123]

This is a big deal.

[Brent]

And I thought I bought the last vehicle I would ever own and now I amy have to trade it in before it is even paid for! Ouch!!

[25 Year Honda Owner]

From Yahoo News this morning:

Honda's new engine

Honda (HMC) says it has developed a "super-clean" diesel engine that will emit no more pollution than a gasoline-powered one. Diesels get up to 30 percent better fuel economy than gasoline engines, but never caught on in the U.S. because they were far dirtier. Honda's would be the first diesel to meet California's tough 2009 air-quality standards. Honda also said it would start selling a hydrogen fuel-cell powered sports sedan in 2008. Toyota took the "environmental crown" with its Prius hybrid, said powertrain analyst Anthony Pratt of J.D. Power & Associates. "Now Honda wants it back." (Los Angeles Times, free registration required)

[meanmachine19]

Pretty interesting....although no mention of the RL I'd be interested in seeing how much HP and mpg difference there will be.

[25 Year Honda Owner]

Originally Posted by meanmachine19

Pretty interesting....although no mention of the RL I'd be interested in seeing how much HP and mpg difference there will be.

This is very interesting:
http://world.honda.com/news/2004/4040506.html

[Hawk]

Sold my '96 PSD for the Ridgeline. Might get better fuel mileage, but the price of the diesel engine, along with the cost difference twix diesel & gas fuel, I'll stick with gas........

[ChrisM]

No new RL for me unless gas gets to $5/gallon. By the time I loose my rear end on trade in value and pay for a new vehicle, I would have to drive the new RL about 250,000 miles to make my loss back.

[jwizard]

They already applied for a patent and Gary Flint was all over Diesel as the gas milegae solution long-term.

[RidgeDOC]

If it will also run on bio deisel this may be a viable solution to gas prices and shortage, but correct me if I'm wrong(I know someone will) doesn't diesel come from the same crude oil that gas does?