Honda Ridgeline Owners Club Forums banner

30,000 mile service price

29K views 46 replies 24 participants last post by  DesertRidgeline 
#1 ·
I contacted my local dealer and they stated that the big 30,000 mile service would cost me $419. Is this the typical price? They also said they would do the transmission update if my truck qualified, which it does.

The service would take 5 hours so I would have to leave it there.
Here is what they do
30,000 Mile Service:

• Change engine oil and filter
• Perform tire rotation
• Perform rear differential service (Ridgeline, Pilot & S2000)
• Replace engine air filter
• Replace cabin filter
• Replace transmission fluid
• Inspect parking brake operation
• Inspect and adjust belts
• Inspect steering system and fluid
• Clean, service and adjust rear brakes
• Inspect 4 wheel alignment
• Inspect suspension components
• Inspect all fluid levels
• Inspect exhaust system
• Adjust idle speed and timing
• Inspect tire wear
• Inspect spark plugs
• Adjust tire pressure
• Service and test battery
• Top off all fluids
• Reset maintenance light
• Perform multi-point inspection
• Road test vehicle


Dealer Recommended Service
• Transmission flush service


HERE IS WHY WE DO IT:
Your Honda is now due for its first major service. All of the previous services have been performed. Now, our Technicians use specialized equipment to be sure that all the mechanical, electronic and computer devices are working properly. At this time, we also recommend addressing your vehicle’s heating and cooling system. Over time, your transmission fluid becomes contaminated, losing its ability to protect your transmission. It also loses its ability to protect the metal components in your transmission from friction and wear, causing premature seal and gasket failure. Very expensive repairs could result from the lack of this required maintenance.

Thanks
Bigdaddyflo
 
See less See more
#2 · (Edited)
Let's break that down to what they actually replace. i know it helps me to fully grasp what they are really doing....

1. Change engine oil and filter
2. Change air filter
3. Change cabin filter
4. Replace transmission fluid
5. Rear diff service (??) Is this just a matter of draining out the old fluid and adding new??

Did I miss anything? If not, then they are doing an oil change, and transmission fluid change, diff fluid change basically. The air filter you can change in all of a couple minutes, and the cabin filt shouldnt take much more than 20 minutes for you (if you follow the threads instructions here on the ROC).

So is the 4 items really worth $419.00? Not to me it isn't. All the checking this and checking that is insanity in my opinion. Checking the 4 wheel alignment? WTF? If you put the vehicle up on the alingment rack, then you're doing an alignment not checking it. Is the car pulling? Are you wearing out tires unevenly? If not, then your alignment would appear to be fine and won't need to be put up on a alignment rack.

Okay so Im not knowledgble on the maintenance minder system, but I was under the impression that it basically did away with the traditional 30k, 60k, 90k 120k type services and now we replace things when the MM system tells us it's time? is this not true?

Anyway, as far as a traditional 30k service that price seems to be on par with the ones that I've seen at the dealer for all other types of hondas, so if that's what you were asking, then the price of $419.00 seems to be inline with other Honda vehicle services.

However if it were me (and it will be one day), I will have them perform items 1, 4 and 5 at the top of the message and call it a day. I'll replace the air filter and cabin filter myself and all that inspection stuff in my opinion is for the birds. I've seen vehicles leave honda stores after a service and come back in with something that broke (like the CV boot started to leak after it was inspected and found to be "ok") that was not detected in a very very expensive 60k service so.....

Tilt: Yes, Im biased/tilted because I know what it really costs the dealer to do these services compared to what they charge us the consumer and it sometimes sends me into a rant. So my apologies for that.
 
#5 · (Edited)
good heavens! $419.00 for a 30K check up?

• Change engine oil and filter
• Perform tire rotation
• Perform rear differential service (Ridgeline, Pilot & S2000)
• Replace engine air filter
• Replace cabin filter
• Replace transmission fluid
• Inspect parking brake operation - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419?
• Inspect and adjust belts - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419?
• Inspect steering system and fluid - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419?
• Clean, service and adjust rear brakes
• Inspect 4 wheel alignment - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419?
• Inspect suspension components - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419?
• Inspect all fluid levels - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419?
• Inspect exhaust system - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419?
• Adjust idle speed and timing
• Inspect tire wear
• Inspect spark plugs - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419?
• Adjust tire pressure
• Service and test battery - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419?
• Top off all fluids - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419? (do they drain the old fluids & put new fluids)?
• Reset maintenance light
• Perform multi-point inspection

i could be buying aftermarket products, instead!!!
 
#9 ·
It's not something I would do unless the idle had become unadjusted. I think the more modern cars like Honda's have something called an Idle Learn Procedure, so when the idle becomes whacked they do that procedure and it allows the computer to relearn the idle (??). In any event I think it was popular back when vehicles were still carburated.
 
#11 ·
i don't know what this has to do with anything, but...

i looked at trading in my motorcycle (2005 honda shadow) and i had done all my oil changes myself, they said that since i didn't have any service records, they wouldn't take it on trade. granted this wasn't a honda delaer, but they did have used hondas there, so i know they took them

i wonder if the same thing would happen to the trucks, esp regarding warranty work

bdr
 
#12 · (Edited)
• Inspect parking brake operation - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419? Only if it's an adjustment
• Inspect and adjust belts - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419? Only if it's an adjustment
• Inspect steering system and fluid - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419? Fluid is likely to be topped up, a repair is not usually covered under the price of the service.
• Clean, service and adjust rear brakes
• Inspect 4 wheel alignment - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419? Not usually - It's just a way for them to make more money to tell you that you need a 4 wheel alignment then charge you an additional 1 or 2 hours of labor.
• Inspect suspension components - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419? Not usually
• Inspect all fluid levels - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419? Sometimes they will "top off" some fluids that are low, but there shouldn't be much low after doing the fluid changes. I guess they mean they will add some water to the winshield washer resevoir and a tablet.
• Inspect exhaust system - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419? Not usually, just another way to make more money if there is a problem.
• Adjust idle speed and timing
• Inspect tire wear
• Inspect spark plugs - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419? Not unless the service specifically states that they are replacing the spark plugs. Generally if the spark plugs need replacing before the normal time, they charge extra.
• Adjust tire pressure (Do you know how expensive air is now adays? Here is the real cost of the service!)
• Service and test battery - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419? No, it's not
• Top off all fluids - if there is a problem; is it covered under $419? (do they drain the old fluids & put new fluids)? Let's hope they do at least that.

My responses are in red.....

But Im sure you already knew all of what I responded ;)



What that someplace won't take a Ridgeline if you don't have proof of oil changes or service records? That seems strange to me. Generally I've seen people bring in their vehicles, and if they are under a certain mileage they get an inspection, a sticker slapped on the windshield and shoved out on the lot. If they are over a certain mileage they call their friendly wholesaler to see which one of them wants it and they wholesale it out to them who then resell it on their own lots. Which is why we generally see vehicles with over 100k on them at little mom and pop lots and the lower mileage vehicles at the dealer lots. I went out with a friend of mine when he wanted to buy a used volvo. We found one on a mom and pop lot and asked where it came from and he told me it came from my parents dealership in Santa Monica so I got on the phone and called the used car manager and asked him to look it up for me, and he tells me that they believed it had been in an accident and hadn't been repaired properly so they wholesaled it out. I have seen some dealerships that will out and out not take a trade in though due to too high of mileage where they tell people that they can't even wholesale the vehicle out and that the customer would be better off privately selling it.

Anyway, it would seem strange to me to see any reseller saying they won't take a vehicle only because the owner doesn't have the service records. Maybe motorcycles are different though. OR Maybe this particular place you went to only sells vehicles that have full service records because they sell easier to the customers.
 
#13 · (Edited)
Sitting at over 94,000 miles, I have not done any of the additional(inspections, etc) services that are offered @ 30,000, or the other mileage milestones. The only work I get done is the oil changed as instructed by the MM, the trans fluid changed out when instructed by the MM, and the VTM-4 fluid changeout when instructed by the MM. The other visual inspections I believe are done as they have the truck up on the rack. I highly doubt they would let any needed service that they could charge $$$ not be brought to my attention.

The only possible exception will come around 100,000 miles when I will have them look at belts, suspension, etc. a little more closely. But I will request these inspections specifically, not go by a recommended list of items.

With the above said, this truck nearing 100,000 miles shocks me with how little service it requires, and how it still drives, and handles so well. I have had other vehicles with this ammount of mileage, and at this mileage point on those vehicles I was already out shopping for a replacement. Not the RL, in my non-internet mechanic opinion this truck has over 200,000 miles in it easy.

Servicing my truck like this works for me, and may not work for others.
 
#14 ·
Servicing my truck like this works for me, and may not work for others.
We have the same thought pattern I think in regards to servicing ones vehicle. Your method is the way that I plan on going with my truck. When the MM system tells me it's time to do something then it will be done and the only thing that is done. Im quite positive too that when they have the truck up on the lift doing the fluid changes they DO look at the rest of the vehicle to find sell ups (adds) to the repair order and then recommend them. Of course things that should be replaced by time that the MM system may not recommend will also be replaced. Im not sure if the T-Belt comes up in the MM system or not, but on my truck it will be replaced at the lowest mileage suggestion (which I think for my driving is 60k)

I know some dealers that I contract with that want a certain amount of labor hours sold on each repair order (well, they would like a certain amount) and so the oil techs are instructed to inspect the vehicle and make note of anything that needs to be repaired/replaced and then the SA is supposed to try to sell it to the customer. So really... During the replacement of the fluids the techs should be inspecting the vehicle and selling you what ever needs actualy replacement or repair.
 
#15 ·
I am a firm beliver in the Honda maintenance check ups every 7500 miles. I drive a 1982 Honda Civic Wagon to and from work most of the time, it now has 184,000 mile on it. When I traded my Blue Ridgeline for the new White I was given $2000 more on the trade because the dealer had done all maintenance work on the truck. To me the price is worth it.
 
#16 · (Edited)
How much were your total invoices from the Honda dealer to do all services from mile 0 to when you traded the vehicle in?

The strong point to using a dealer in my opinion is for actual repairs so that you know they are going to have to stand behind their work, but even then theres a whole lot of guess work going on. I've seen more than ample vehicles come in wth a problem and the tech guesses at what will fix it, and it might end up costing the customer more than it should if the tech was able to actually replace the right part instead of replacing a part, finding out it didn't repair the vehicle, then replacing another part, then it does fix the vehicle then the tech tells the service advisor that the vehicle needed both parts to fix the problem when it really didn't. Never the less, they have to stand behind their repair and if travelling you can go to any honda dealer if the problem reoccurs in the warranty period.
 
#17 ·
Adding my .02 cents. I'm a life long mechanic and a 29 year Auto Trades teacher. Those that have money will pay for the services provided by the service department of the dealership. This gives them peace of mind. Those that are mechanically inclined will do as much "DIY" as they can and only use the dealer service department when needed. Dealerships make money on service- whether you need it or not. If they can sell you on it- your wallet will be lighter. Good dealerships will follow the recommendation of Honda and the "MM". Less than good dealerships will scare you into expensive services that you may not need and are not cost effective because they make money for the dealership. Money makes the world go round and old school thinking is hard to change.

BTW- I have 16,700 miles on my 7 month old RL. I follow the "MM". I was brought up and used to believe that the regular recommended 3000 mile oil changes were necessary and recommended dealership service made your vehicle last longer. I now know that I used to make money(for the dealership) and spend money(my money) on un-needed service. Take care of your vehicle and it will take care of you.
 
#18 ·
What's the manual say for 30,000 miles? I don't have it in front of me, but seems to me that's what I'd follow. I'm making the assumption that all of these inspections/services are not there.
 
#19 ·
The manual no longer goes by mileage, just the MM codes. This is what it has for maintenance schedule:

If the message ''SERVICE DUE NOW'' does not appear more than 12 months after the display is reset, change the engine oil every year.

NOTE:


Independent of the maintenance messages in the information display, replace the brake fluid every 3 years.

Inspect idle speed every 160,000 miles (256,000 km).

Adjust the valves during services A, B, 1, 2, or 3, only if they are noisy.


Symbol
Maintenance Main Items

A
Replace engine oil.

Engine oil capacity without oil filter: 4.0 L (4.2 US qt).

B
Replace engine oil and oil filter.

Engine oil capacity with oil filter: 4.3 L (4.5 US qt).

Check front and rear brakes.

Check pads and discs for wear (thickness), damage, and cracks.

Check calipers for damage, leaks, and tightness of mounting bolts.

Check parking brake adjustment.

Check the number of clicks (10 to 12) when the parking brake pedal is pressed with 294 N (30 kgf, 66 lbf) of force.

Inspect tie-rod ends, steering gearbox, and gearbox boots.

Check rack grease and steering linkage.

Check boots for damage and leaking grease.

Check fluid lines for damage or leaks.

Inspect suspension components.

Check bolts for tightness.

Check condition of ball joint boots for deterioration and damage.

Inspect driveshaft boots.

Check boots for cracks and boot bands for tightness.

Inspect brake hoses and lines including VSA.

Check the master cylinder and VSA modulator-control unit for damage and leakage.

Inspect all fluid levels and condition of fluids.

Engine coolant.

Automatic transmission fluid (ATF).

VTM-4 rear differential fluid (Honda VTM-4 Differential Fluid).

Power steering fluid.

Brake fluid.

Windshield washer fluid.

Inspect exhaust system*.

Check catalytic converter heat shields, exhaust pipes, and muffler for damage, leaks, and tightness.

Inspect fuel lines* and connections*.

Check for loose connections, cracks, and deterioration; retighten loose connections and replace damaged parts.


Number
Maintenance Sub Items

1
Rotate tires, and check tire inflation and condition.

Follow the pattern shown in the Owner's Manual.


2
Replace air cleaner element.

If the vehicle is regularly driven in dusty conditions, replace the element every 15,000 miles (24,000 km).

Replace dust and pollen filter.

If the vehicle is driven mostly in areas that have high concentrations of dust, pollen, or soot in the air, replace every 15,000 miles (24,000 km).

Replace the filter whenever airflow from the heating and air conditioning control system is less than normal.

Inspect drive belt.

Look for cracks and damage, then check the position of the drive belt auto-tensioner indicator.


3
Replace automatic transmission and transfer fluid.

Driving in mountainous areas at very low vehicle speeds or trailer towing results in higher transmission and transfer fluid temperatures. This requires transmission fluid changes more frequently than recommended by the Maintenance Minder. If the vehicle is regularly driven in these conditions, replace the transmission and transfer fluid every 30,000 miles (48,000 km).

Automatic transmission fluid capacity: 3.1 L (3.3 US qt), use Honda automatic transmission fluid (ATF-Z1).

Transfer fluid capacity: 0.43 L (0.45 US qt), use hypoid gear oil GL4 or GL5.


4
Replace spark plugs.

Use IZFR5K11 (NGK) or SKJ16DR-M11 (DENSO).

Replace timing belt. If the vehicle is regularly driven in very high temperatures (over 110 ºF, 43 ºC), or in very low temperatures (under -20 ºF, -29 ºC), or towing a trailer, replace every 60,000 miles (USA models)/100,000 km (Canada models) and inspect water pump.

Inspect the valve clearance (cold). Intake: 0.20-0.24 mm (0.008-0.009 in.), Exhaust: 0.28-0.32 mm (0.011-0.013 in.).


5
Replace engine coolant.

Capacity (including the reservoir tank): 6.2 L (1.64 US gal), use Honda Long Life Antifreeze/Coolant Type 2.


6
Replace VTM-4 rear differential fluid.

Driving in mountainous areas at very low speeds, towing a trailer, or frequently driving fully loaded results in a higher level of mechanical (shear) stress to fluid. This requires differential fluid changes more frequently than recommended by the Maintenance Minder. If you regularly drive your vehicle under these conditions, have the differential fluid changed at 7,500 miles (12,000 km), then every 15,000 miles (24,000 km).

Capacity: 2.64 L (2.79 US qt), use Honda VTM-4 Differential Fluid.


NOTE: According to state and federal regulations, failure to do the maintenance items marked with an asterisk (*) will not void the customer's emissions warranties. However, Honda recommends that all maintenance services be done at the recommended interval, to ensure long-term reliability.
 
#20 ·
Big Daddy- I use the link below from Edmunds to double check service prices for routine maintenance and inspections. I entered an 07 RTL w/o navi and clicked on the 30K service interval. The report indicates total cost for 30K maintenance is $261.79 (168.07 labor & 93.72 parts). I've read on other forums stories of owners showing up with the edmunds printout and the service department matching prices.
Good luck,
Bishop0802

http://www.edmunds.com/maintenance/...ission=AUTOMATIC&zip=21012&synpartner=edmunds
 
#21 ·
Had my 15,000 mile service done yesterday at the dealer. They found no problems, charged me $198.00.
The SA said that at 30,000 miles I would need to have the rear brakes replaced. I asked if there was anything wrong with them as was told no but typically at 30,000 rear brakes needed to be replaced. The SA said to just remember that 5 more oil changes and it would need to be done.
Does this sound "normal" to be done on everyones Ridgeline? :eek:
 
#24 ·
It depends on how you drive. I've seen people wear out brakes every 12,000 miles like clockwork, and I've seen others that can go over 50,000 miles with the same set of pads. Hell, I did over 100k on my older Nissan Hardbody truck years ago.

Whatever the case, if you go in (Honda4x4) at 30,000 miles don't let them sell you brakes only based on "because it's got 30,000 miles on it). Ask what they are down to and then decide accordingly.

IMO, 30k on a set of rear brakes sounds a bit low for my driving habbits. When many people were getting all of 15k on their Volvo's pads, I was using them up to 45k, so it just depends on your driving habbits on when they will wear out.
 
#25 ·
Thanks for all the responses. I have a friend that works in a garage that can do all of the listed service items at 30,000 for half the price. He thought the 419 was a little high, since they would only really "do" 4 items on the list and one of them was the oil which I had changed when I bought the truck at 28, 450 miles.

I really want the tranny update more than anything. For the people who have had it, was it covered under warranty or is it a cost?

Later

Bigdaddyflo
 
#26 ·
If you're referring to the Transmission TSB, then it is free. If your VIN falls within the range of the TSB, and you complain about it "sticking" in gear when passing, they should perform it for you. I had it done, and it now shifts much more smoothly.

You may need to complain once or twice before they do it, though. Some dealers are hesitant to do a TSB for something they can't duplicate easily since they don't get much $$ for doing it. But, if you have a good relationship with your dealer, it shouldn't be a problem.

Good luck!!
 
#27 ·
One of the items referred to in an earlier thread was the transmission fluid replacement/flush. If the repair center wants to hook up a machine and just suck out the old fluid, DON"T. Honda does not recommend this and all you are doing is sucking fluid back through the filter leaving contamenents. A proper transmission service includes removing the transmission oil pan, replacing the filter, cleaning the pan, replacing the pan gasket, and putting in new fluids. This does not have to be done at 30,00 miles but only with the MM tells you. Honda has paid a lot of brilliant engineers to figure this out. A service manager who recommends a fluid flush is just trying to make more money.
 
#28 ·
"A proper transmission service includes removing the transmission oil pan, replacing the filter, cleaning the pan, replacing the pan gasket, and putting in new fluids. "

You might want to check your sources on this. Honda trannys, as far as I know, don't have an oil pan to remove and clean, a filter to change, a pan gasket to replace (because no pan). You can drain the fluid easily and replace with, I believe, 3 quarts (at least that's what it is on my MDX. haven't done the RL yet) or you can change 3, drive a little, change 3, and drive a little more to change the last 3. On my '03 MDX, because of Acura's miserable history of tranny failures up to the '02 model year, I do a 3 quart change every-other oil change. This keeps the fluid relatively fresh at all times and kinda keeps the costs down. I also dont' drive all that much since I retired so I change the oil approx every 6 months. Fluid changes are EASY for the DIYer. I also recommend getting the shop manual, which costs approx $70. Lots of great info and the savings on your first service you do yourself will more than pay for the book. If you do change the fluid yourself be sure to remove the filler plug BEFORE you remove the drain plug. Nothing worse than draining the fluid and then not being able to remove the filler plug to put fluid in. Justa thought. Good luck!! ;)
 
#29 ·
" because of Acura's miserable history of tranny failures up to the '02 model year;)
Wow... you weren't kidding. I checked CR's reliability rating on the MDX. They show, for Transmission, Major: black (below average) through '02, white (average) for '03, and Red (above average) from '04 on. That is very uncharacterstic for Honda/Acura.
 
#30 ·
No, it's really not that un characteristic for Honda, they've almost always had troubles to one degree or another with their automatic transmissions, it only came to a full head by the year 2002. But all the dealers that I contract with are seeing 03's and 04's fail at an abnormal rate as well, though whether AHM will put out a voluntary transmission warranty extension as they did on some model 99-01's remains to be seen. They probably have some set number that needs to fail before they officially acknowledge a widespread problem.
 
#32 · (Edited)
Desert;

CR is the only non-anecdotal source of statistics I have access to. So for what its worth, they show above average (solid red) for both the Accord and the Civic A/T starting in '04.

The Civic was above average in all years back through '98 with the exception of '01.

What this suggests (to me) is that the Honda was having a problem (statistically speaking) with A/T's when matched with a higher torque engine. And, apparently, they improved their A/Ts across the board somewhere in late '03 which reflects excellent performance on all subsequent years. If true, I suspect a light foot meant little or no problem in those trouble years, but if you use the stronger engine regularly... or don't carefully adhere to the maintenance schedule.. those years had a higher chance than "average" of having a problem.

In summary, I see no reason to distrust Honda's A/T... from '04 on, based on CR's data.

It would be helpful if we knew what they did to the '04 transmissions and beyond. Was it a redesign, or a simple internal fix to the previous design.
 
#31 · (Edited)
I worked at a Volvo dealership for three years and if you think the technician is going to spend 5 hours on your car your wrong...Just think about it, theres only 8 hours in a workday..You think that tech is only going to work on one or two cars that day..I used to get 10-15 cars a day..And come on, this is a new car do you think the tech is going to check all that stuff...Your car will be washed and ready to go in less than 2 hours I guarentee..The tech still gets paid for 5 hours..Thats just the way it goes in the business..It's called flat rate..
Just to enlighten you a little more, I used to do transmission R&R's in 5 hours, they pay 10 hours so I doubled my pay rate on those jobs..
With that being said I'm not condemming dealers, hey I woked at one and I think it's the best place to take your Honda..They know your car best and they get factory support other shops dont get..
The dealer will keep your honda running its best and stay on top of issues that may come up that other shops have no idea about. I know it's a little more expensive at the dealer but consider how much money you spent on this vehicle.
Oh, if you think most cars get roadtested by techs after minor repairs your wrong..Most of my roadtest were from my stall to the back parking lot or wash bay...No time for that. Just keepin it real..I'm sure I will take alot of heat for this reply..haaa
 
#43 · (Edited)
I agree, most of the qualified honda techs at the stores that I contract with can have a "major" service done in about 1.5 hours, it's what was always and still is termed the "gravy" work.

When I worked full time as a service advisor we were told that if a customer was going to wait for a major service they would be waiting 5+ hours even though we all knew it would be done in 1.5 to 2.0 hours at most, and the car was finished and put into the back lot where the consumer wouldn't know it had been finished because it was considered harder to explain to them back then what the flat rate system is.

It reminds me of when I took my Nissan Hardbody truck into the dealer to get a bed liner installed, they charged me something like 2 or 3 hours worth of labor and had the job done in 45 minutes. When I asked the service manager about it, he responded by telling me that he had put multiple mechanics on the job to get it done faster since I was waiting which was total garbage since I saw the one mechanic working on it the whole time. But this was the flat rate back then and it was probably easier for the SM to try to explain it this way then actually explain it properly to me.
 
#35 ·
CR reliability data is reported by CR subscribers and purchasers of the product in question. Unless they're all automotive engineers, their data is subjective. Not expert opinion. Limited to their own experience. Anecdotal.
 
#36 ·
CR's statement on how they collect the data:
THE SURVEY AND OUR RATINGS

The 2007 Annual Car Reliability Survey is the largest of its kind and gathered responses on almost 1.3 million vehicles owned or leased by Consumer Reports or ConsumerReports.org subscribers. Those results underpin the most comprehensive reliability data you'll find anywhere. Such a large survey response allows us to provide reliability data on most new or redesigned for 2007 models, and we can also report on some expensive and low-volume models.

Predicted reliability for 2008 models is our forecast of how well the models that are currently on sale are likely to hold up, based on how they've done in the past. It's based on the reported overall reliability (used car verdicts) for the newest three models years (2005-2007) if the model hasn't changed significantly for 2008. One or two years of reliability data may be used if a model was new or has been redesigned in that period or if we don't have data for more years.
-------------------------------

Ok, it IS based on CR's subscribers. Answering survey questions... did you have a problem with your transmission in the last year? Yes/No

That is not a subjective question. One either did, or didn't. Over enough car owners, the answer is statistically significant. That is not subjective, and it is not anecdotal.

In other words, you can get a statistically significant result from a survey. Since we can not see the data, or the method of analysis.. T values, regression analysis r2 values etc, one can not be sure of the validity. However there is no other method available to you, or me, that has more significance. Period.
 
#37 ·
Of course it's subjective, and it's also anecdotal. It's one person's opinion on what constitutes a problem, and the samples are from laypersons. Most people aren't qualified to judge whether their transmission is unreliable. And what constitutes unreliability, anyway? It's subjective. Too subjective for a simple yes or no answer, even though I thought the answers were based on a scale, which adds even more subjectivity to the data.

Check how many threads are on this forum that attempt to report "problems", which are not problems at all. How many of these issues get reported as "problems" to CR?

ABS check
Transmission lever action
VTM-4 lock usage
Tighten fuel cap

and so on. People don't even read their owner's manuals. They'd rather post a question on an Internet message board, and trust that answer over the official publication from the manufacturer. So what makes the masses an objective judge of reliability?
 
#39 ·
Remember the data is relative. Unless you assume one set of owners is significantly different than another, the data will give relative reliability.

Do you doubt there was a relatively greater number of problems with the MDX prior to '04?

As an engineer/scientist, I have no access to Honda's schematics, or even their design in a general sense. Even if I did, one can not determine reliability by examination of such. You may pick faults with the design, but chances one could not pick out a problem by such. Even within Honda, they must have good testing capabilities to evaluate a given design. Testing is key. But the results from the "field" are also critical. I'm sure they pay attention to their dealers reports AND CR.

They must build a vehicle that covers even the mechanically challenged careless person. Since, as you say, there are lot of them out there. :)

If you are saying that a knowledgeable person, maintaining a vehcile correctly, will take the same pre-'04 transmission and not have a problem... probably the answer is yes. On the other hand, that same knowledgeable person is more likely to have zero problems if the "average" person does not.

No?
 
#38 ·
Curious as to who at CR takes all those transmission responses and decides what the benchmark is for reliability?

Here's one I didn't see on the survey...
Was your truck delivered with Body Wrinkles? Yes/No

:D
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top