[Ice]

Story time!! Everyone gather round, grab a cup of joe and have a seat!

Despite my futile attempt at over-maintaining (here), it was all for naught. At 86,000 miles, the transmission has failed. Let me preface by saying that Honda did help out quite a bit with the cost for the transmission replacement and the dealership (Russell & Smith Honda) stepped up big time. The truck was never taken off-road, nor doing any sort of towing. The closest thing to towing would be hauling my 425 pounds motorcycle 150 miles to COTA race track and back a couple times. The transmission was completely trouble free prior to the failure. There was no warning and no sign of any sort. Everything had always worked perfectly as it should from day 1.

It all started by a subtle lurch while driving home from work, cruising in traffic hours (40-50 mph). It behaved as if it missed a gear. The RPM would suddenly surge while driving, like your kid yanking the shifter to Neutral while you were driving. There was no engine light, or any indication. As I got closer to home with more stop and go traffic, the truck progressively shifted harder and harder. As I pulled into the garage, the dash lit up like a Christmas tree, engine light with all sorts of warnings. I pulled the code P0776: Clutch Pressure Control Solenoid Valve B Stuck Off:

I dropped off the truck at the dealership that evening. I went back home and did some research. To my horror, there are many stories like this on ROC. To that, I appreciate greatly the guys who went before me and shared their wisdom. The information helped tremendously as you will see shortly.

The advisor from dealership called me a day or two later. He said they attempted to "flush" the transmission fluid hoping to unstuck the solenoid but it did not work, and that the truck will need a new transmission as the dealership does not fix or replace internal parts. He mentioned something about the transmission fluid looks off and doesn't seem like original Honda DW-1 fluid. I can see the direction of this conversation was heading and what he was hinting at. I have done all maintenance work myself after the 3 years/36K miles warranty has expired. All the oil changes, transmission fluid, transfer fluid, and rear differential fluid, all done by me. Only Honda OEM fluids have been used. Since they did not have those maintenance work on record, sorry we cannot help you. I told the advisor all the work has been done on the schedule, and it's ludicrous that the technician think the fluid is not DW-1 when it certainly is. I was told that the cost to replace the transmission with a remanufactured (reman) unit would be $10,600, all inclusive of labor and and taxes.

I asked the advisor if there's a good-will application from Honda to help with the cost, considering that I have bought 3 Honda vehicles from this dealership, with the latest a 2022 Pilot. The advisor said yes, he can forward to his boss to submit a good-will application for this transmission replacement. However, he will need a copy of the receipts of all the fluids I have purchased if I indeed did all the work myself. Apparently they still think I was being untruthful and that I used unapproved fluid that caused the problem. Luckily, I was able to pull the receipts from the online purchases at Majestic Honda and sent them off to the advisor. He called me the following evening and said the good-will application has been approved!! Pretty quick turn around I would say! He said considering my loyalty to Honda and to the dealership, and the fact that I did indeed purchased all the fluids for the vehicle from a Honda dealership, Honda will foot a majority of the cost. My total cost out the door would be $4,500, down from $10,600. Now, based on my research around this forums, other guys are paying around $3,000 for a new transmission, although that was before covid inflation. I told the advisor that at the risk of sounding ungrateful, even though I really am, why am I paying $4,500 when other folks are paying $3,000. He went off rambling something about they're not the same work (they are) and cost inflation yada yada (true and I understand), but he can try to help me somewhat and reduced the total to be $4,300. At that point, I figured to not push my luck any further and told the guy ok , $4,300, let's do it, but add in a brake fluid change while they're at it. While we were on the phone, I asked for the cost to do timing belt and valve adjustment for future reference since it's almost time to do those anyway. He told me timing belt job would be $1,300 and valve adjustment $600 on top. Why am I telling you this? This is why.

Before I hung up the phone with the guy, I told him I will swing by to pick up the parking tag for my work since it will be at least a week for the new transmission to come in and a few more days for them to work on it. I got to the dealership, the advisor walked me to the truck to get the tag. Before I left, he pulled me aside and told me his boss has a proposal for me. In my head I was thinking yes sure, your boss wants to buy the truck from me for bottom price, and I can drive home with a brand new 2023 Ridgeline (and 72 more months of payment). But that wasn't what I heard. He said my boss proposed that if it's ok with me, since they are already down there replacing the transmission, they can replace the timing belt, free of charge. I was shocked and bewildered. WHAT??? Free? From a Honda dealership? I thought the guy was messing around. I asked 3 times if I heard him correctly and he said yes sir, we will do your timing belt for free. I went home and sent a text to the advisor, wanting to making SURE that they will also replace the water pump and the tensioner, and not just the timing belt. They actually did it, free of charge!

The final bill was 4600. New transmission, torque converter, timing belt job (belt, tensioner, water pump), brake fluid flush and 14 days of car rental (which I paid for 4 days because dealership can only cover 10 days). I essentially paid 3K for a new transmission + new torque converter, and $1300 for timing belt job. The new transmission definitely has a new programming. Whereas before it would want to upshift as soon as it could, the new transmisson is eager to go above 3K RPM and STAY in the powerband as long as it could. I normally turned ECO off with the old transmission because it bogged down too much with ECO turned on. The new transmission, with same foot pressure, it's impossible to drive smoothly in stop and go traffic. It's like a wild horse that just want to rev up and take off. Perhaps I could learn to feather the pedal with the new transmission to drive smoothly with ECO off with more seat time. For now, driving with ECO on is perfectly fine with me.

The technician noted a few thing. The timing belt tensioner was leaking a little bit. It was good timing that they did the timing belt at 86K miles. The left front strut was slightly leaking. Weird that the other 3 are fine, and the truck has never been off paved roads. But that's for another day for another thread.

My take in all of this? I'm glad Honda took responsibility and helped out, even though I did not have warranty of any sort. As the truck is an asphalt queen, it's embarrassing for a Honda to need a new transmission at 86K miles. I was shocked and genuinely surprised that my dealership offered to throw in a timing belt job, even after I have submitted defeat and they had zero reason to help out. It really does help cushioning the blow quite a bit. The new transmission is fantastic! I wish I didn't have to pay $4600 for it.

Lesson 1: ALWAYS USE HONDA FLUIDS. If anything happened, don't count on Honda to help if you used anything aftermarket.
Lesson 2: Buy from reputable source and save your receipts!
Lesson 3: Honda 6-speed transmission is fine for a 3500 pounds Accord (I had one), but not a 5000 pounds Ridgeline.

Zroger, please add one to the statistics.

 

[bluegrass]

Thank you for the detailed write-up of your situation.

Interesting that Honda provided so much goodwill help with you being 26,000 miles out of warranty.
Do you have any further information on how this came to be? Seems like an unusually easy/quick approval process. Just provide a few receipts for fluids, and Honda Corporate approves a $6000 goodwill claim in a matter of hours???

Also, you should change the title of this thread to something like "Another Blown Transmission, But Honda Steps Up". It would get a long more views than your current lengthy technical title.

 

[Vinny in ATX]

Excellent detailed writeup. Great to know your dealer stepped up. But certainly a shame to have a transmission replacement at 86K miles.

 

[silkiechicken]

Thanks for your write up! I am happy this worked out in your favor. I am in a similar situation right now, with one of the codes also being P0776, except I do not have the receipts for the 24+ quarts of DW1 transmission fluid that I've bought to do 8 DF's in the last 140k miles.

 

[Ice]

Thanks for your write up! I am happy this worked out in your favor. I am in a similar situation right now, with one of the codes also being P0776, except I do not have the receipts for the 24+ quarts of DW1 transmission fluid that I've bought to do 8 DF's in the last 140k miles.

I read through your entire ordeal. What a headache! I thought the 2 weeks ordeal that I had to go through was a lot of hassle and being uncomfortable taken out of my comfort zone, dealing with an unfamiliar rental and pending enormous bill. I don't know what would be worse, my transmission failing suddenly and spectacularly, or your intermittent issue off and on. It's definitely not a good feeling when your baby didn't live up to potential despite all the TLC that you have poured into it. My best advice for you is to gather all the receipts and evidence as much as you can. Sometimes, they just need something to attach to the application. Don't be afraid to ask your dealership for discount. Be super nice to your advisor, but never accept the first number he throws at you. Always say thanks, but it sounds a little high, is there any discount he could apply to help lower the cost a bit? Every time I asked, the cost would magically dropped by a few hundreds. Best of luck Silkie! I will be following your thread. Please keep us updated!

 

[SEW]

Nice writeup. Great outcome!

I used to believe that thorough, meticulous maintenance (self) would insure trouble-free service. Wrong! Those days are long gone. I use great care in fluid replacements, driving, vehicle always garaged, easy environment , etc; yet, I had virtually every problem a ‘17 RL can have. I don’t know if ANY of my extra care (trans, transfer case, rear diff - every 20K, oil every 5K) helped in any way. Trans at 79K. On my ‘22 , changed transfer case and rear diff @10 K and will every 15 K. Trans @40K and 80-100K. Keep receipts of all my fluids, etc. Honda only.

I’ve gone through multiple other manuf forums. I’m glad I don’t own a Taco, Frontier, one of the Big 3.

Comparing what we experience today against what we experienced decades ago might not look so good. Comparing what we have today verses what others have today is more relevant.

 

[silkiechicken]

@Ice Thank you for the well wishes. Unfourtantly all I have are hand written documents and not receipts. Of which, something hand written over years is a heck of a lot harder to "forge" than a digital set of documentation. I would hope that literally tracking every tank of fuel and maintenance item would lend credibility to our meticulous maintenance of the vehicle.

 

[Will48121]

Thanks for the write up. I was just going to post asking if all these transmission failures show any warning signs. I’m at 73,000 on my 17 with no issues. My certified warranty expires at the end of this year and I’m just getting nervous. I’m thinking I should just get rid of it before the warranty expires as who knows if I’d be so lucky with Honda good will as you are. I do have every receipt for my fluids, filters, crush washers also from the Honda dealer. It’s a shame, because there really isn’t another truck like it right now, but I don’t think I’d buy another one. Maybe the next generation with the 10 speed and redesigned interior, but it will be long before I can get one used at a reasonable price.

 

[SEW]

If practical, I’d change and get a ‘23. I did and got a ‘22.

Generally, vehicles improve thru the life of a production run. Specifically, with the Gen 2 RL, transmission, FIs , wiring harness, hood (matter of opinion), etc.. For me, this Gen 2 1/2 will likely be my last truck (76 next month) , and I average <10 K a year since our Venza is our primary traveling vehicle.

Likely, just IMO, the Gen 3 with the new interior of the Pilot, engine/10-sp, and whatever redesign, will be a nicer truck yet. I believe it will be a more reliable vehicle than the ‘17-‘19.

 

[zroger73]

@Ice Thank you for the well wishes. Unfourtantly all I have are hand written documents and not receipts. Of which, something hand written over years is a heck of a lot harder to "forge" than a digital set of documentation. I would hope that literally tracking every tank of fuel and maintenance item would lend credibility to our meticulous maintenance of the vehicle.

Perhaps you can go through and print relevant posts from this forum where you mentioned each ATF change as sufficient evidence?

 

[Duke_of_TX]

I want to hear how this story goes when dealing with a transmission specialist.

I need to call a few transmission shops and see if they have any insight to what’s going on. I have a ‘17 at 65k miles. The days and getting shorter for sure. Got me waiting for failure.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Vinny in ATX]

This sucks for you guys/gals that have to sweat it out fearing your transmissions will go out at 80K-ish miles. If the maintenance schedule is followed, you should not have to worry about a transmission failure (or engine) on ANY brand of vehicle for the first 100K miles. Even the old Yugos had a 100K mile warranty (just sayin!).

 

[silkiechicken]

Perhaps you can go through and print relevant posts from this forum where you mentioned each ATF change as sufficient evidence?

That's a good idea, since there are time/date stamps for the updated posts, along with a photo of the drain plug at the first change floating around.

I actually did make a print out of the MM sequence that I have posted with mileage and code, along with my digital documentation of the transmission issues by date of when they occurred. When I handed it to the tech, he looked at it, and asked me where I found it. I told him it's my personal record of maintenance for this vehicle and I could see the gears spinning in his head. The service advisor photocopied the sheet and attached it with a print out of the codes their computer found.

@Vinny in ATX I feel like with regular maintenance, even 100k is a short life in a modern vehicle. I am wondering if these 6 speeds have some sort of finite # of shifts before they start gong bonkers. I almost feel like perhaps I made it to 142k, where others are imploding at far less mileage, just because the vast majority of my driving is going from gears 1-6 and then sitting in 6th for 30+ mile stretches.

 

[Will48121]

If practical, I’d change and get a ‘23. I did and got a ‘22.

Generally, vehicles improve thru the life of a production run. Specifically, with the Gen 2 RL, transmission, FIs , wiring harness, hood (matter of opinion), etc.. For me, this Gen 2 1/2 will likely be my last truck (76 next month) , and I average <10 K a year since our Venza is our primary traveling vehicle.

Likely, just IMO, the Gen 3 with the new interior of the Pilot, engine/10-sp, and whatever redesign, will be a nicer truck yet. I believe it will be a more reliable vehicle than the ‘17-‘19.

That's a good idea, since there are time/date stamps for the updated posts, along with a photo of the drain plug at the first change floating around.

I actually did make a print out of the MM sequence that I have posted with mileage and code, along with my digital documentation of the transmission issues by date of when they occurred. When I handed it to the tech, he looked at it, and asked me where I found it. I told him it's my personal record of maintenance for this vehicle and I could see the gears spinning in his head. The service advisor photocopied the sheet and attached it with a print out of the codes their computer found.

@Vinny in ATX I feel like with regular maintenance, even 100k is a short life in a modern vehicle. I am wondering if these 6 speeds have some sort of finite # of shifts before they start gong bonkers. I almost feel like perhaps I made it to 142k, where others are imploding at far less mileage, just because the vast majority of my driving is going from gears 1-6 and then sitting in 6th for 30+ mile stretches.

id like to see an updated trans failure thread with mileage, type of fluid used as well as change intervals and also if VCM was disabled. I notice on mine with VCM enabled the transmission just feels funky when cruising, I guess from the converter being locked and unlocked and also coasting downshifts. Also if these failures changed the transmission filter ever. I did mine when I got the vehicle around 60k since I didn’t know the history of the vehicle.

 

[silkiechicken]

@Will48121 @zroger73 Has the most comprehensive listing of known failures on the board all nicely assembled in a pinned thread. Although there are "a lot" of failures, getting the details of the service history for that listing is going to be hard, and at the end of the day, my guess is that the sample size for those with VCM disabled and those not following the MM is going to be too small to make any meaningful conclusion.

 

[14v6]

Nice that the dealer stepped up. When my BIL had his Odyssey in for a ring job warranty extension they offered to do the TB for $400.

As for this ordeal, so this his how the system works for a pretty good outcome? It cost 10k for a new trans installed, customer pays $4,300 for that and Timing Belt and everyone is supposed to be happy?

If everything went to plan customer would be paying 2k for the TB job and a trans should be supposed to go past 86k. Yes, it's a lot better than paying 10k but the bottom line is after the powertrain warranty is up it's a discretionary call unless you have HondaCare and that could only get you to 120k.

There are posts on the forum of how Honda had the top vehicle in just about every category. How many Hondas are on the list for best vehicles to own long term? Sometimes I think this is a liability of having a vehicle that is built in small numbers, tends to confuse the issue despite the trans being in the Pilot.

@silkiechicken, any way to show the charges for the DW-1 from statements and a history dump of some sort from the vendor?

 

[silkiechicken]

@14v6 Unfortunately, I don't always use the same dealer when buying fluids and I doubt they have a record of who I am when I go in to buy them, short of a credit card #, and sometimes I use cash. The only DW1 "proof" I would have is in the thread where one of the dealers accidently sold me 9 quarts of DW1 from their 55gallon bulk drum. Maybe I should start online documenting everything in the form of pictures on a public forum. lol

 

[Ice]

Do you have any further information on how this came to be? Seems like an unusually easy/quick approval process. Just provide a few receipts for fluids, and Honda Corporate approves a $6000 goodwill claim in a matter of hours???

It really was that easy. I asked, emailed the receipt, and that was that. I really do think Honda corporate is well aware of the issues with the 6-speed. It explains why they pivoted away from the 6 speed transmission so fast, only using it for 3 model years in 2017, 2018, 2019, before changing it to 9 speed ZF. This is their way to keep the issue quiet and avoid having to do a recall on the transmission.

I used to believe that thorough, meticulous maintenance (self) would insure trouble-free service. Wrong! Those days are long gone. I use great care in fluid replacements, driving, vehicle always garaged, easy environment , etc; yet, I had virtually every problem a ‘17 RL can have. I don’t know if ANY of my extra care (trans, transfer case, rear diff - every 20K, oil every 5K) helped in any way. Trans at 79K. On my ‘22 , changed transfer case and rear diff @10 K and will every 15 K. Trans @40K and 80-100K. Keep receipts of all my fluids, etc. Honda only.

I agree with you 100%. That old school thinking no longer applies to these new cars. They aren't built like they used to. I have NEVER had the need to buy extended warranty. I mean, it's a Honda! The expectation for any Honda that I own, is that it would be completely trouble free for at least 100K miles at a minimum, if not 150K. This whole transmission issue really has shattered my trust in Honda sadly.

Thanks for the write up. I was just going to post asking if all these transmission failures show any warning signs. I’m at 73,000 on my 17 with no issues. My certified warranty expires at the end of this year and I’m just getting nervous. I’m thinking I should just get rid of it before the warranty expires as who knows if I’d be so lucky with Honda good will as you are. I do have every receipt for my fluids, filters, crush washers also from the Honda dealer. It’s a shame, because there really isn’t another truck like it right now, but I don’t think I’d buy another one. Maybe the next generation with the 10 speed and redesigned interior, but it will be long before I can get one used at a reasonable price.

If I was in your shoes, knowing what I know now, I would trade in it for a 2022 or 2023 Ridgeline. The 6-speed is a ticking bomb that inevitably will fail right around 70-90K miles (pending usage, like silkiechicken who got 146K out of her trans). If you have read all the documented failure in this forums, the vast majority has the same exact failure as mine, right around 80K miles on average. I have invested a lot in this Ridgeline, customizing a lot of the features to my liking, deadened all the doors, speakers, hood strut, light bar... It's my baby that I have taken care of to the best of my ability since the day I drove it home. It doesn't feel right to trade it in after all the work and TLC I have put in to it. My rule of thumb for keeping a used vehicle past 100K miles is that for every 1000 dollars that I put into the vehicle, I should expect to get another year out of it to break even. After paying 4600 for a new transmission, if I could get another 5 years, I will be happy and satisfied to trade it in at 10 years mark like I originally have planned. I don't know if they fixed the issue with the new 6-speed that they have put in the truck, but I will assume I have 5 years and 86K miles before it implode again.

I feel like with regular maintenance, even 100k is a short life in a modern vehicle. I am wondering if these 6 speeds have some sort of finite # of shifts before they start gong bonkers. I almost feel like perhaps I made it to 142k, where others are imploding at far less mileage, just because the vast majority of my driving is going from gears 1-6 and then sitting in 6th for 30+ mile stretches.

I think you're getting warmer with this. I live in a suburb commuting into a major city (Houston) daily for work. Lots of freeway, but also lots of stop and go traffic. Honda didn't build the part (in this case the pressure solenoid) with enough durability to last. Bean counters 1, Engineers 0.

id like to see an updated trans failure thread with mileage, type of fluid used as well as change intervals and also if VCM was disabled. I notice on mine with VCM enabled the transmission just feels funky when cruising, I guess from the converter being locked and unlocked and also coasting downshifts. Also if these failures changed the transmission filter ever. I did mine when I got the vehicle around 60k since I didn’t know the history of the vehicle.

Full disclosure: Only Honda DW-1 ever used. No engine mod of any kind. Transmission filter was changed at 80K when doing the Code B1,3,6. Transmission oil has a single D/F every 8K miles since new. At 80K miles it had 4x D/F. 6K miles later transmission solenoid failed. Transmission never had any issue, no judder nothing, smooth like butter prior to the failure.

 

[Will48121]

It really was that easy. I asked, emailed the receipt, and that was that. I really do think Honda corporate is well aware of the issues with the 6-speed. It explains why they pivoted away from the 6 speed transmission so fast, only using it for 3 model years in 2017, 2018, 2019, before changing it to 9 speed ZF. This is their way to keep the issue quiet and avoid having to do a recall on the transmission.


I agree with you 100%. That old school thinking no longer applies to these new cars. They aren't built like they used to. I have NEVER had the need to buy extended warranty. I mean, it's a Honda! The expectation for any Honda that I own, is that it would be completely trouble free for at least 100K miles at a minimum, if not 150K. This whole transmission issue really has shattered my trust in Honda sadly.


If I was in your shoes, knowing what I know now, I would trade in it for a 2022 or 2023 Ridgeline. The 6-speed is a ticking bomb that inevitably will fail right around 70-90K miles (pending usage, like silkiechicken who got 146K out of her trans). If you have read all the documented failure in this forums, the vast majority has the same exact failure as mine, right around 80K miles on average. I have invested a lot in this Ridgeline, customizing a lot of the features to my liking, deadened all the doors, speakers, hood strut, light bar... It's my baby that I have taken care of to the best of my ability since the day I drove it home. It doesn't feel right to trade it in after all the work and TLC I have put in to it. My rule of thumb for keeping a used vehicle past 100K miles is that for every 1000 dollars that I put into the vehicle, I should expect to get another year out of it to break even. After paying 4600 for a new transmission, if I could get another 5 years, I will be happy and satisfied to trade it in at 10 years mark like I originally have planned. I don't know if they fixed the issue with the new 6-speed that they have put in the truck, but I will assume I have 5 years and 86K miles before it implode again.



I think you're getting warmer with this. I live in a suburb commuting into a major city (Houston) daily for work. Lots of freeway, but also lots of stop and go traffic. Honda didn't build the part (in this case the pressure solenoid) with enough durability to last. Bean counters 1, Engineers 0.



Full disclosure: Only Honda DW-1 ever used. No engine mod of any kind. Transmission filter was changed at 80K when doing the Code B1,3,6. Transmission oil has a single D/F every 8K miles since new. At 80K miles it had 4x D/F. 6K miles later transmission solenoid failed. Transmission never had any issue, no judder nothing, smooth like butter prior to the failure.

Such a shame. I guess Honda knew it wasn’t a good transmission since they only used it a couple years and went to the 9 speed In the 2020.

 

[zroger73]

Honda used the 6-speed transmission from 2009 to 2020. It seems most problematic in 2016-2020 Pilots and 2017-2019 Ridgelines.