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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
I didn’t add the fuel because I needed it, I added it to get rid of it. Which I now wish I hadn’t had done lol
 

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@njamesj What is considered low? Less than 1/4? Less than 1/8th? I do kind of wish the fuel tank was larger...

@bm6w We always get rid of our extra fuel in the lawn mower for the fear of what you're experiencing. I hope you can burn through your tank a few times and get everything back to normal. As for injectors... I'd probably just keep running through new fuel for a while and see if things improve. It's going to take several tanks of gas to run through all the sequentially diluted bad fuel. Plus, lol, never know if you might throw a code that can get your injectors covered under the TSB 21-010! We had the emissions system x-mas tree of display lights at near 100k and it was covered by the updated TSB that extended to 150k miles.
 

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And why would you make this comment? Why is this a bad idea?
One reason is the fuel pump is located in the tank. The in-tank fuel pump is cooled by the amount of gasoline in the tank. The less gas, the less cooling! Less cooling, premature failure of the in tank fuel pump. Personally, I like to not let my tank get too much below a half a tank for that reason. On back to on topic, the reason you should never dispose of old fuel in a vehicle is it will cause issues just like the OP is having. Hope his Issue clears up with running fresh gas and cleaning out the tank with the old fuel.
 

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One reason is the fuel pump is located in the tank. The in-tank fuel pump is cooled by the amount of gasoline in the tank. The less gas, the less cooling! Less cooling, premature failure of the in tank fuel pump. Personally, I like to not let my tank get too much below a half a tank for that reason. On back to on topic, the reason you should never dispose of old fuel in a vehicle is it will cause issues just like the OP is having. Hope his Issue clears up with running fresh gas and cleaning out the tank with the old fuel.
Anecdotally, I generally let my tanks run down until deep into the LF light. I've never had a problem with the fuel pump. Have about 178k on the Pilot and 126k on the Ridgeline. I sorta think that low fuel/fuel pump thing is a red herring.
 

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@speedlever

My understanding of the modern fuel pumps is that the motor itself is cooled by the fuel being sucked through it, more so than the fuel bath it sits in, of which don't most new tank designs have the pump sitting at the lowest point? And isn't the whole condensation thing a relic of the past when tanks were metal?
 

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And isn't the whole condensation thing a relic of the past when tanks were metal?
Condensation is the process where water vapor becomes liquid as air is cooled to it's dew point (google it).

It does not matter the material the tank is made of, condensation will create liquid inside any tank as the air is cooled. All air contains liquid.

The difference in modern tanks that are no longer metal is that they will not rust. The fuel in that tank will capture the liquid from the air. The more air in a tank, the more liquid that will be created during those temperature changes.
 

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Update: I added HEET and 3 gallons of fresh fuel. The car appears to run fine now without and CEL's - however it cranks a bit at start up. Thinking maybe I need new injectors.
I'd just keep running it. As you add more fresh gas, it will get better. Glad you got it figured out!
 

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Condensation is the process where water vapor becomes liquid as air is cooled to it's dew point (google it).

It does not matter the material the tank is made of, condensation will create liquid inside any tank as the air is cooled. All air contains liquid.

The difference in modern tanks that are no longer metal is that they will not rust. The fuel in that tank will capture the liquid from the air. The more air in a tank, the more liquid that will be created during those temperature changes.
While this is true, a truck that is driven regularly will easily burn thru any trapped condensation very easily. Now if one were to let the truck sit for a few months, the increased air space combined with NOT removing the water on a daily/weekly basis might be an issue.
 
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I didn’t add the fuel because I needed it, I added it to get rid of it. Which I now wish I hadn’t had done lol
Best advice at this time is to fill the tank with fresh fuel. If there is gas available in your area with ethanol, that will be even better. Make certain it is Top Tier to help with the cleaning properties.
 

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"If there is gas available in your area with ethanol, that will be even better." Wow, I didn't I would ever hear someone say that! I understand your thinking though! . . .Here in the mid-atlantic the ONLY thing readily available is E10.
 

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I would not normally recommend ethanol diluted gasoline either, but this is a case where the ethanol will help the bad moisture infused gas in the tank. I drive 20 miles one way to buy ethanol free gas for my power equipment and my Corvette. In some situations, the ethanol is beneficial.
 

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I would not normally recommend ethanol diluted gasoline either, but this is a case where the ethanol will help the bad moisture infused gas in the tank. I drive 20 miles one way to buy ethanol free gas for my power equipment and my Corvette. In some situations, the ethanol is beneficial.
Why would ethanol be a benefit in his case? It causes moisture to be drawn into the fuel more than pure gasoline, right? I don't think it would absorb water already in the tank, would it?
 

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You answered your own question...the ethanol draws the moisture into the fuel where it is burned along with the gas and ethanol...just like water injection.
 

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You answered your own question...the ethanol draws the moisture into the fuel where it is burned along with the gas and ethanol...just like water injection.
Meh... his fuel most likely already has ethanol in it, it was just overwhelmed by the bad gas. Bad gas <> water in the fuel.

If anything, I'd fill it up with Rec Gas, as the added cost for more "pure" gas would be worth it for at least one or two tanks. But I'm sure the dilution process with E10/15 will suffice.
 

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The OP in Post #10 said the old gas did not contain ethanol. It would have been even worse if it did because the ethanol will separate over that period of time. The only absorbent in his tank is the Heet he added which indeed if it is not IsoHeet contains methanol.
 

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The OP in Post #10 said the old gas did not contain ethanol. It would have been even worse if it did because the ethanol will separate over that period of time. The only absorbent in his tank is the Heet he added which indeed if it is not IsoHeet contains methanol.
Correct, but I was more referring to the gas already in the truck as well as what he added after the problem developed (i.e. normal gas from the pump; at least where I live, it is hard to find non-ethanol gas).

I'm sure he's on the road to recovery, especially as he dilutes the bad gas even more.
 

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Correct, but I was more referring to the gas already in the truck as well as what he added after the problem developed (i.e. normal gas from the pump; at least where I live, it is hard to find non-ethanol gas).

I'm sure he's on the road to recovery, especially as he dilutes the bad gas even more.
I was at 1/4 tank. That’s an 80 mile range - I guess we have different opinions of “very little fuel”
This was Post #20, he did not have much gas in the tank which may or may not have had ethanol. and then he added only 3 gallons after continuing to have starting problems. Again, with or without ethanol.
 

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@speedlever

My understanding of the modern fuel pumps is that the motor itself is cooled by the fuel being sucked through it, more so than the fuel bath it sits in, of which don't most new tank designs have the pump sitting at the lowest point? And isn't the whole condensation thing a relic of the past when tanks were metal?
I don't think condensation is a relic of the past at all. Best to keep a full tank to minimize condensation which can occur under various environmental conditions. (temp change, etc). But regular driving will help keep condensation at bay too. When I don't drive my Ridgeline much, I tend to add fuel stabilizer to the tank to help keep the gas fresh longer. I don't think that does much for condensation, but I think parking in my garage helps minimize the environmental changes that help create condensation.
 

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I don't think condensation is a relic of the past at all. Best to keep a full tank to minimize condensation which can occur under various environmental conditions. (temp change, etc). But regular driving will help keep condensation at bay too. When I don't drive my Ridgeline much, I tend to add fuel stabilizer to the tank to help keep the gas fresh longer. I don't think that does much for condensation, but I think parking in my garage helps minimize the environmental changes that help create condensation.
100%

All anyone needs to do to see if condensation still exists is to put a plastic tub outside during the day with a lid on. Then nest morning, open it up and observe every surface covered with moisture.

Yes, it happens in modern plastic tanks just as it does in ANY material subject to environmental moisture and temperature changes. A regularly used ICE will not suffer from condensation, even if E10/15 gas is used because the water settles out and is burned regularly. The problems occur when said motor is not operated, and small daily accumulations of water become larger and larger over time.

The other issue is that gas which sits for long periods of time, even without moisture present, ages and becomes less volatile. As it ages, it goes from clear to a yellowish color, and the smell changes drastically. If you ever smell bad gas, you'll immediately be able to tell bad from good. And 5 gallons of bad gas is more detrimental than 5 gallons of gas with water in it.

Most boat owners have dealt with this, sometimes on the mild side, other times on the extreme side which requires the entire tank to be pumped out and disposed of.
 

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Here in NH we try not to let our vehicles sit with much less than 1/2 tank in the winter. The moisture in the air above the fuel condenses on the tank walls then runs down into the tank under the gas. From there depending on where the tank outlet is it can get into the fuel line. If it’s cold enough it freezes and blocks the tank outlet or fuel line.
 
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