[ccr]

Images from the back of the new G2 Black Edition wheels.

So yes, 18x8 with a 55mm offset.

 

[ccr]

And relevant specifications for the current OEM Firestone 18" tires, and the larger tires stated to have been on the show trucks, as well as the Gen1 18" Michelins and similar sized Michelin comparisons...


Gen2 OEM Tires…

Firestone Destination LE2 245/60R18 105H SL
UTQG: 520 A A (data indicated on tire)
Max Load: 2,039 lbs.
Max Inflation Pressure: 44 psi
Tread Depth: 11/32”
Tire Weight: 31 lbs.
Rim Width Range: 7-8.5”
Meas. Rim Width: 7”
Sect. Width: 9.8”
Tread Width: 7.9”
Overall Diameter: 29.6”
Revs. Per Mile: 704
Country of origin: US



Show Truck Tires (based on statements further back in this thread)...

Firestone Destination A/T P265/60R18 109TSL
UTQG: 460 A B
Max Load: 2,271 lbs.
Max Inflation Pressure: 44 psi
Tread Depth: 11/32”
Tire Weigt: 40 lbs.
Rim Width Range: 7.5-9.5”
Meas. Rim Width: 8”
Sect. Width: 10.7”
Tread Width: 8.2”
Overall Diameter: 30.5”
Revs. Per Mile: 683
Country of origin: CA



Gen1 OEM 18” Michelin Tires that most raved about…

Michelin LTX M/S P245/60R18 104T SL
UTQG: 440 A B
Max Load: 1,984lbs.
Max Inflation Pressure: 44 psi.
Tread Depth: 11/32”
Tire Weight: 32 lbs.
Rim Width Range: 7-8.5”
Meas. Rim Width: 7”
Sect. Width: 9.8”
Tread Width: 8.1”
Overall Diameter: 29.6”
Revs. Per Mile: 703
Country of origin: US



For comparison…

Micheline Premier LTX 245/60R18 105V SL
UTQG: 620 A A
Max Load: 2,039 lbs.
Max Inflation Pressure: 44 psi.
Tread Depth: 8.5/32”
Tire Weight: 32 lbs.
Rim Width Range: 7-8.5”
Meas. Rim Width: 7”
Sect. Width: 9.8”
Tread Width: 8”
Overall Diameter: 29.5”
Revs. Per Mile: 703
Country of origin: US


Micheline Premier LTX 265/60R18 110V SL
UTQG: 620 A A
Max Load: 2,337 lbs.
Max Inflation Pressure: 44 psi.
Tread Depth: 8.5/32”
Tire Weight: 32 lbs.
Rim Width Range: 7.5-9.5”
Meas. Rim Width: 8”
Sect. Width: 10.7”
Tread Width: 8.4”
Overall Diameter: 30.5”
Revs. Per Mile: 682
Country of origin: US


Michelin LTX M/S2 P265/60R18
UTQG: 720 A A
Max Load: 2,271 lbs.
Max Inflation Pressure: 44 psi.
Tread Depth: 10.5/32”
Tire Weight: 35 lbs.
Rim Width Range: 7.5-9.5”
Meas. Rim Width: 8”
Sect. Width: 10.7”
Tread Width: 8.2”
Overall Diameter: 30.5”
Revs. Per Mile: 682
Country of origin: US

 

[ccr]

Here is a pic of the RTL-T with the 22 inch wheels.

TSW Sochi knockoffs?

Just keep an eye on the load rating of the wheels you choose and their construction. There are a lot of big cheap wheels out there with subpar load ratings.

 

[ccr]

The tire and wheel company dealer uses said the size tires for the ridgeline he recommends is 255/50 on the 20 inch wheels.

There are two Michelin Premier LTX tires in that size, with the following specs, just for comparison (tires are like food, people like what they like, and spend what they want to spend):

Micheline Premier LTX 255/50R20 109V XL
UTQG: 620 A A
Max Load: 2,271 lbs.
Max Inflation Pressure: 50 psi.
Tread Depth: 8.5/32”
Tire Weight: 31 lbs.
Rim Width Range: 7-9”
Meas. Rim Width: 8”
Sect. Width: 10.4”
Tread Width: 8.6”
Overall Diameter: 30.2”
Revs. Per Mile: 687
Country of origin: US


Micheline Premier LTX 255/50R20 110H XL
UTQG: 620 A A
Max Load: 2,337 lbs.
Max Inflation Pressure: 50 psi.
Tread Depth: 8.5/32”
Tire Weight: 31 lbs.
Rim Width Range: 7-9”
Meas. Rim Width: 8”
Sect. Width: 10.4”
Tread Width: 8.6”
Overall Diameter: 30.9”
Revs. Per Mile: 671
Country of origin: CA

Same weight as the 18" Firestone OEM, higher load ratings, and the first is only slightly taller, so your speedo wouldn't be too far off.

However, those won't fill the wheel openings nearly as much as a taller 22 with a 45 series tire (which are usually up in the 32" tire diameter range). There is also an optical illusion happening with larger wheels due to the larger wheel diameter, and likely, greater width on the wheel and less offset, which physically pushes the wheel outward but also has a way of making them stand out (what is closer also appears larger).

But nothing fills the opening like overall size, which also leads to greater speedometer error, and all the higher forces working on the suspension and brakes.

 

[ccr]

... I would try to keep total weight of any wheel/tire combination close to stock. ...I put a lighter wheel/tire combo on one of my slightly modified Miatas and the improvement in acceleration and braking performance was fairly significant due to the lower rotational inertia. Really surprised me.

I am with you on this. Sucking up torque and weighing down suspension with a needlessly heavy wheel/tire combo is a sad price to pay for fashion. And yet sturdy-yet-light wheels with good load ratings in larger sizes are rare. The lighter/stiffer quality stuff is gonna cost ya.

Do any companies make quality wheel spacers for the Honda bolt pattern?

5x120 wheels spacers are out there, however the center bore is the larger concern. Many aftermarket wheels require hub rings, to fill the space between the larger center bore on the wheel and the smaller Honda hub size (64mm, I believe). Some spacers will provide both duties: decrease offset and function to adapt the wheel to the hub.

Most engineer types will frown on the use of spacers. They'll suggest the purchase of the correct wheel with all the characteristics you may want to fit your vehicle and even possibility add the benefit of lowered unsprung weight, as toddyridge mentions^. It's a cost/quality/compromise question. There are high quality larger wheels out there that may be ordered with exact diameter/width/offset/center bore. But these are not $149 specials at your local tire shop.

 

[ccr]

I agree 100% that the less rotating mass, the better. I've read/watched a few reviews about the new Shelby GT350-R with the carbon fiber wheels. The reviewers are simply speechless with the handling difference the wheels make.

Unsprung weight hanging at the end of suspension is like the pendulum of a clock. The greater the mass and weight, the more its effect on inertia, meaning that once in motion it wants to keep going until the inertia is exhausted (like the pendulum of a clock slowing down and changing direction). So in our case this slows reaction time of the suspension, making it slower to react to changes in direction as the tire meets oncoming changing surfaces.

Then there is the ratio of unsprung weight to sprung weight, which effects ride quality. Remember the big old boats of the 1970s? When you have a multi-ton vehicle even heavy steel wheels are a much lower ratio of mass compared to the vehicle riding on the springs. Net result is plush wallowy ride. Floaty. Like a boat!

So with lighter modern cars there is a design dilemma to create good ride quality, because that ideal ratio requires unsprung weight much lower due to the lighter sprung weight. So materials become a bigger factor (like carbon fiber... which also apparently offers much greater stiffness, such that the wheels do not distort in the way that alloys wheels do).

As for a Ridgeline with carbon fiber wheels, I have to wonder that the cost would approach half the value of the current Black Edition Ridgeline. So... maybe not.

 

[ccr]

http://www.ridgelineownersclub.com/forums/2096889-post214.html

 

[ccr]

well....that answers one question I posed in the "picture thread" although can't make out the size. Looks like a bit less offset than stock. Tires look good and your setup fills the wheel wells much better than stock IMO.

P265/60R18. Yes, "a bit" less offset, as in 23mm!

Had these tires on my first 2014 SE Ridge. Didn't wish to modify the front fender wells on the Gen1 to prevent rubbing, which would have required body seam modification and then flattening of the plastic fender liner and splash guard. The real downer was that they robbed too much torque. They also introduced a little bump steer, er... bounce steer, but they really kicked ass on powdery and loose dirt roads and smoothed out both offroad terrain and the urban jungle too. Taller sidewalls really have their place at times, until that heavy turn-in at 75MPH, of course!

The press/dealer junket trucks were stated to have some "rub" with the bigger Firestones and, presumedly, stock wheels and no spacers. Something about the raised letters in the inside sidewall wearing. Stock Gen2 BE wheels being 55et, I chose to push outward a bit to see how these old M/S2s fit. These have raised letters, turned inward. As it it, I have plenty of clearance off the sidewall (from the strut, which is one typical area of issue).

I have one small rub-a-dub at the front rear inner liner, at full lock and on throttle/suspension articulation. I will comment further once I understand more.

These tires are 9/10th's inch taller, and 3/10th's inch wider at the tread, with fairly square tread edges, whereas the quieter/lighter/more-highly-rated Michelin Premiere LTX in the same size has a wider tread width, yet I wonder that the greater edge radi might play nicer with inner fender clearance. Those Premiers in the 265 size are also the same weight as the OEM Firestones, which is helpful (so four pounds lighter each compared to these M/S2s). I am still collecting data on wheel weight.


Gen2 2017 Honda Ridgeline "BE" as received:
Firestone Destination LE2 245/60R18 105H SL
UTQG: 520 A A (data indicated on tire)
Max Load: 2,039 lbs.
Max Inflation Pressure: 44 psi
Tread Depth: 11/32”
Tire Weight: 31 lbs.
Rim Width Range: 7-8.5”
Meas. Rim Width: 7”
Sect. Width: 9.8”
Tread Width: 7.9”
Overall Diameter: 29.6”
Revs. Per Mile: 704
Country of origin: US

Current set of tires:
Michelin LTX M/S2 p265/60R18
UTQG: 720 A A
Max Load: 2,271 lbs.
Max Inflation Pressure: 44 psi.
Tread Depth: 10.5/32”
Tire Weight: 35 lbs.
Rim Width Range: 7.5-9.5”
Meas. Rim Width: 8”
Sect. Width: 10.7”
Tread Width: 8.2”
Overall Diameter: 30.5”
Revs. Per Mile: 682
Country of origin: US

 

[ccr]

@ccr: I notice that your OE Firestones are listed as 105H 320 A A. Mine are 105H 520 A A. Is this a typo, or did we get different tires? Tirerack.com shows the 105H 320 A A as the OE tire; however, I've checked mine three times (all four tires, too) to make sure that I wasn't reading the tire wrong, and mine say 105H 520 A A.

Well, this is interesting... good catch!

I had a look at my image database. Sure enough, the back of the tire that was on my Gen2 BE, a 245/60R-18 105H (as opposed to a P245/60R-18 104H) is marked "520". And yet Firestone's own online spec data does not include Uniform Tire Quality Grade Standards (UTQG) data whereas Tirerack includes it, but it would appear to be incorrect. Tirerack also indicates the weight is 31 lbs., while Firestone indicates 32 lbs.

Firestone lists the two 245/60R-18 tires far apart, so I have composited the data under the column header for easier reading on these forums.

Based on averaging some scale data, the Gen2 BE tire/wheel combo is about 60.5 lbs (without TPMS, but with tire weights), which if the tires are 31-32 lbs, suggests that the BE 18x8 wheels are under 29 lbs., which isn't too bad for an OEM cast alloy wheel.

 

[ccr]

All of the other data on the back of the Gen2 OEM 245/60R-18 Firestone:

 

[ccr]

Isn't that the same wheel that is listed as the "chrome look" wheel for the Ridgeline?

That seems to be the case.

My early assumption is that the new "chrome-look" wheels likely have the same offset as the new Gen2 Ridgeline wheels, which are 55mm.

 

[ccr]

I also have the Continental LX20's mounted. 265-65-18. Zero issues with rubbing.

Given that those Conti's have nearly an inch taller sidewall (1/2 the 1.9 inch total diameter increase), I think the reason they don't rub is due to a combination of tread width, tire shape and wheel offset.

I've been documenting details related to how and why bigger tire/wheel combos rub, which I will share in another post.

I experience rubbing at a seam/wheel well liner bump at the lower-rear of the front wheel well (not too different from where rubbing commonly occurred on the Gen1 Ridgeline). In this case the outer rear corner of the tire rubs at full lock. It's not the side of the tire, it's the actual OD, which swings across and into the wheel well bump.

Here are the OEM and Conti tire specs for comparison:

Firestone Destination LE2 245/60R18 105H SL
(data from tirerack, unless noted)
UTQG: 520 A A (data indicated on tire)
Max Load: 2,039 lbs.
Max Inflation Pressure: 44 psi
Tread Depth: 11/32”
Tire Weight: 31 lbs.
Rim Width Range: 7-8.5”
Meas. Rim Width: 7”
Sect. Width: 9.8”
Tread Width: 7.9”
Overall Diameter: 29.6”
Revs. Per Mile: 704
Country of origin: US


Continental Crosscontact LX20 265/65R18 114S SL
(data from manufacturer and tirerack)
UTQG: 740 A B
Max Load: 2,601 lbs.
Max Inflation Pressure: 44 psi
Tread Depth: 12/32”
Tire Weight: 31 lbs.
Rim Width Range: 7.5-9.5”
Meas. Rim Width: 8”
Sect. Width: 10.7”
Tread Width: 8.1”
Overall Diameter: 31.5”
Revs. Per Mile: 659
Country of origin: US


So even while the Conti is quite a bit taller, the tread width is only 2/10th's of an inch wider, the edge of the tire is rounded, and, more importantly, the chrome-look wheel offset is still 55mm. That greater offset translates to pulling the tire/wheel inward, towards the hub and away from the inner wheel well at full lock (towards the hub, moving ~45º diagonally from the back wall of the lower wheel well), effectively pulling it away from the area where I note rubbing to occur.

Thus, my informed outlook is that if you choose to install bigger tires (translated as either or both taller and more massive), there are a few primary factors to consider in your overall compromise:

Wheel Offset
Tread Width
Tire Edge Shape

You may be able to push the odds on one or two of those elements, but if you push all of them AND go larger in diameter and/or increased mass, you are probably gonna RUB.

And, obviously, if you are close to rubbing and you install tire chains, you will likely tear the crap out of the plastic inner wheel wheel liner.

That's where you may want to be careful when relying on a "tire guy's" guarantee. Not rubbing and full OEM operational expectations are differing requirements.

 

[ccr]

Tires are Pirelli Scorpion Verde +....

Pirelli Scorpion Verde All Season Plus 255/50 R20109H XL
(data from tirerack)
UTQG: 740 A A
Max Load: 2,271 lbs.
Max Inflation Pressure: 50 psi
Tread Depth: 10/32”
Tire Weight: 35 lbs.
Rim Width Range: 7-9”
Meas. Rim Width: 8”
Sect. Width: 10.4”
Tread Width: 8.7”
Overall Diameter: 30.1”
Revs. Per Mile: ?
Country of origin: MX

Any idea what the wheel offset is?

That's a highly rated tire, btw:

 

[ccr]

They are the 109H M+S... ...The wheels are Versante alloys...

Thanks you for the follow-up, CJMDWYER.

So the specs listed for that wheel...

Model: Versante VE-504
Manufacturer's P/N: 504285547+35DFB
Diameter: 20 inches
Width: 8.5 inches
Bolt Pattern: 5x120mm
Offset: +35mm
Backspacing: 6.25"
Hub Bore: 72.56mm

They're available at most discount wheels shops on the net and eBay for about $200 per wheel.

It would be interesting to know if there are markings on the back of the wheel indicating ratings, specifically load rating, which is often stated in kilograms.

Given that the hub bore on the Versante is larger than the Ridgeline's 64mm hub, I have to wonder that the dealer's tire guy installed hub rings, which is pretty standard for aftermarket wheels that are intended for use on a wide variety of vehicles with different hub sizes. I have them to adapt my Black Rhino (TSW) wheels, which similarly have larger hub bores.

 

[ccr]

I respect that this thread is about bigger tires, but in many cases most folks are putting their bigger tires on bigger wheels, so there are a number of little things to consider with regard to function. While some of us are do-it-yourselfers and some rely on the integrity of resellers to guide us and sell us the right stuff, here is a starter, in no particular order:

weight
offset
load rating
center bore
width

To their detriment, most manufacturers and resellers do not state load rating and wheel weight. I weigh my wheels, and tires, and wheel/tire assemblies, because I want to know how those factors may impact my vehicles (some of which I drive very fast). Load rating is another useful tool, as it implies strength-to-weight ratio, yet can certainly suggest some other things, depending on wheel construction.

(Note to mods: would it be reasonable to create a sticky thread with a title of something like "Bigger Tires and/or Wheels". There is another Second Generation 2017+ thread discussing wheels. The subjects tend to overlap.)