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hey @Nitram987 , pardon me for asking this, but looking at the TSB it states only the 2017 trims, not a 2018? Was there a revision that included the 2018?

Looking at Post #10 of this thread (https://www.ridgelineownersclub.com/threads/tsb-17-025-and-17-026-judder-from-the-torque-converter-lock-up-clutch.180625/#post-2617409) were you able to take the snapshot on your scanner when corresponding with Honda Canada?
- Same thread, Post #16 seems promising

With only 26K on the ODO, you should not be having any of this issue. Have you thought about installing an aftermarket fan on the OEM Transmission cooler to see if anything improves?
 

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My original intentions when we started towing with the Honda was to service the transmission once a season whether it needed it or not. I still have not looked into what this would entail?

I am over 1k pounds heavier than Nitram and I am running 1 inch taller tires than stock.

Looking at the factory cooler location I couldn't see putting a fan in there unless you make a habit out of towing in bumper to bumper traffic. It actually looks to be pretty decently located to me. It could stand to be much larger IMO.
 

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My original intentions when we started towing with the Honda was to service the transmission once a season whether it needed it or not. I still have not looked into what this would entail?

I am over 1k pounds heavier than Nitram and I am running 1 inch taller tires than stock.

Looking at the factory cooler location I couldn't see putting a fan in there unless you make a habit out of towing in bumper to bumper traffic. It actually looks to be pretty decently located to me. It could stand to be much larger IMO.
You're running in D4 most of the time while towing, IIRC. Some transmissions, like engines, suffer much more from lugging than from running them at higher rpm. I don't know if Honda's transmissions are susceptible to this same phenomena, but may be worth investigating.

It would be good to know at what speeds Nitram is towing... if he's towing much at lower speeds (e.g. - up long hills at under 45mph), the lack of airflow may be the killer.

If it were me, and Honda support was a dead end, i would do the multiple DnF, upgrade the cooler, probably add a bigger fan, and monitor trans temp with Scangauge. If one were diligent, they could add a manual switch to the fan and turn it on when trans temp approached 185, and turn back off when temps were normal.

I think @Venphic added an aftermarket cooler and/or thermostat, but had issues with the t-stat? My memory is a little fuzzy on that one.
 

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I think @Venphic added an aftermarket cooler and/or thermostat, but had issues with the t-stat? My memory is a little fuzzy on that one.
No, your memory is still intact!
Here is the thread >> https://www.ridgelineownersclub.com/threads/2017-ridgeline-transmission-cooler.200578/page-2

Cooler fans such as a Derale 16620 or a Spal 30103018 hooked up to the stock ATF cooler may result in some benefit. If that does not work, something like a Mishimoto MMOC-F or a B&M 70298 or even a Hayden 526 ATF coolers may work. Just do not bypass the ATF warmer.
 

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No, your memory is still intact!
Here is the thread >> https://www.ridgelineownersclub.com/threads/2017-ridgeline-transmission-cooler.200578/page-2

Cooler fans such as a Derale 16620 or a Spal 30103018 hooked up to the stock ATF cooler may result in some benefit. If that does not work, something like a Mishimoto MMOC-F or a B&M 70298 or even a Hayden 526 ATF coolers may work. Just do not bypass the ATF warmer.
I'm sorry, with a new vehicle, although these are "possible" solutions, I would not accept them, I'd be looking elsewhere, and trust me, I'm a Honda Loyalist
 

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I'm sorry, with a new vehicle, although these are "possible" solutions, I would not accept them, I'd be looking elsewhere, and trust me, I'm a Honda Loyalist
I guess it comes down to whether or not the ride, handling, comfort, mpg, power, utility, etc., of the Ridgeline is worth a small engineering fix that Honda did not see as an ROI from the factory.

IOW, if that "fix" solves your issue, then you get to keep all the benefits of the Ridgeline. Otherwise, you're moving on to a vehicle that is less capable in most other respects.
 

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I agree @Carsmak , but those are possible options. I am not recommending aftermarket coolers for just day to day operation.
However, I do not see this G2 Transmission overheat issue being widespread, as it seems to be. Few folks who have complained, seem to have resolved it with the TSB route.
I believe there was one member, my memory fails me, who had his transmission replaced for other reasons while towing.
 

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Discussion Starter #48
Yes, 26K miles (42K Km) on a 2018 AWD Sport Ridgeline pulling an 8' wide travel trailer weighing 4200 pound fully loaded for 1/2 of that odometer reading and I need to replace the ATF. It's burnt and the truck is exhibiting Judder (Google Honda TSB 17-025 and 17-026). Honda disregards the swaying RPM that I showed them as the torque converter fails to stay locked up hopefully just due to the degraded ATF. BTW, those TSBs listed here are not honored in Canada, so I will be doing the 3x drain and flush next week on my own dime. I'm concerned and not very happy. To monitor things, I bought, installed and entered the custom codes into a Scan Gauge II to clearly see the ATF temp. The next time I tow the travel trailer will be revealing.
So, to me it sounds like there is a software fix that should "maintain the transmission fluid temperature within the desirable range under all driving conditions," according to TSB 17-025. If that helps fixes the problem, them my faith in the Gen2 may get restored. Nowever, TSB 17-026 suggest the software update does not always work.

Nitram987, if your dealer is not going to honor those Honda TSBs, do you have a plan on how to get the software updated on the PGM-FI or transmission? Could you easily get yourself to a US dealership or is that too far/hard?
 

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I am with @Carsmak. If the vehicle cannot reliably operate within the design operating environment as stated, it's time for another vehicle. I'm not interested in performing Honda's engineering for them. Now if it's just a tiny percentage of owners having issues, perhaps those fall outside the QA bellcurve, and that's another issue altogether.

I would be interested in Gary Flint's perspective on this, were he still involved in the RL project.
 

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I would be interested in Gary Flint's perspective on this, were he still involved in the RL project.
Few weeks back, when I checked with Joe in regards to Gary, Joe told me that Gary put 'everything behind' and is enjoying his retirement. For the sake of respect, I did not pursue anything beyond that.
 

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Yep, I've seen the same. But I'd still enjoy his perspective on the G2 RL and the transmission issue being discussed in particular.
 

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I would be interested in Gary Flint's perspective on this, were he still involved in the RL project.
While perhaps not the perspective you seek, one of your own posts led me to these from Gary Flint that IMO may well be pertinent to the 2G tranny discussion:
Joe 鈥 the peak torque and power gain with premium fuel is not the greatest benefit for using this fuel. The biggest benefit is honestly at torque converter stall temperature (mid-speed torque band). This is also the RPM range you are frequently using when cruising and is therefore the greatest merit for fuel economy. If this is your sole justification 鈥 it will be difficult to financially justify. The key merits are in power, 鈥済-feeling鈥 or seat of the pants acceleration response at 录 throttle, shift busy (how much it un-locks the torque converter or down shifts), and of course towing (which is essential at maximum load which is why it is recommended when towing).

Premium fuel increases the peak torque at 4500 RPM from 32.4 kg-m to 34 kg-m. The torque at the torque converter stall speed is increased from 30kg-m to 32.4 kg-m (~2400 RPM). Premium fuel in this speed range improves the torque margin which will increase the time spent in 5th gear with the torque converter in lock-up mode. This will result in improved fuel economy depending on the grade and temperature conditions (low temperature is good for power 鈥 but bad for aero). The ignition timing is also advanced further in this mode which reduces the fuel consumption (leaner burn rate). The greater the grade, the more the difference in improved fuel economy due to the increased power.

Peak power is at 5740 RPM 鈥 247 HP with Regular fuel. Peak power with premium fuel is approximately 258 HP (However, this is only true if you are wearing your copper bracelet. I am offering those for $29.99 for anyone that is interested in this tremendous opportunity.). The torque falls off at peak power between 5,000 and 6,000 RPM. This is operating mode is usually at WOT under extreme acceleration.

I hope this clears up the engineering merit of premium fuel.

PS- A Honda engine is not fully broke in until it has between 7-10,000 miles on the vehicle (depending on the manufacturing tolerances). Do not worry about achieving your optimum fuel economy until you get the vehicle broke-in according to the recommended guidelines described in your owners manual.
And
Joe- I have never done a engineering comparison to quantify the FE merits of premium. It is directionally better. I personally always run premium fuel in every vehicle and engine I own 鈥 motorcycles, lawn mowers and even the weed- whacker. The dirt bikes I own also recommend premium. With the Ridgeline compression ratio 鈥 it is not essential to use it 鈥 except when you are towing. This is not marketing hype 鈥 this is driven by engineering need. It will also help reduce the transmission temperature in heavily loaded low-speed maneuvers due to the reduced torque converter slip (because you have more engine torque).

If we mandated premium for all driving situations, we could raise the compression ratio and improve the power and fuel economy. However, that is not the strategy for the Honda channel.

On the EPA cycle, premium will make a difference. I do not know the absolute difference when measured on the dyno. It sounds like an intriguing evaluation if we ever have time to play.

I thought I would provide some absolute torque and HP data on a center spec engine ran in controlled test modes (engine dyno). The data is absolutely true. Don鈥檛 waste your time listening to marketing hype about air cleaners and exhaust systems to achieve HP or fuel economy. Safe yourself the cash and buy the fuel which actually achieves results.

My offer still stands for the copper bracelet if anyone is interested. Should I also prepare some vitamin supplements for the fuel tank?
Yes, both written in 2007 and in the context of the 1G / 5-speed, and there's certaainly no basis for expecting the absolute values mentioned to apply to the 2G / 6-speed.

But I'd suggest that (not withstanding Honda's omission of a recommendation to use premium fuel when towing with the 2G) the underlying principles and potential benefits as it relates to tranny temp may apply to the 2G / 6-speed:
  • Premium fuel likely allows the PCM to alter engine parameters with the effect of making more torque available at lower / certain RPM ranges in comparison to lowest recommended octane fuel, even on the 2G
  • This may not manifest in a 'performance increase' that is perceptible by butt-dyno, nor may it be the most economical in terms of $/mile, nor may it be strictly necessary to prevent damaging detonation even under load stress in the 2G
  • But, a more advantageous TQ curve may allow the 2G 6-speed tranny to operate in more efficient (cooler) modes, particularly when 'load stressed'
Just one guy's speculation for the consideration of readers. Suggesting it's 'reasoned' speculation and no wilder than some others that've been advanced.

Yeah, it'd take a lot of effort to prove yea-or-nay. But it'd take not-so-much effort to do some 'towing tests' with different fuel grades while watching TFT on a Scangauge to get some anecdotal 'evidence'.

And if running premium while towing, even lacking a specific recommendation by Honda, made a positive difference 鈥. well, that's a price I'd be quite willing to pay in return for all the other unique advantages I enjoy by owning a Ridgeline.
 

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Discussion Starter #53
...most heat is caused by fluid shear in the torque converter. In order to minimize heat, you'd want to keep the torque converter clutch fully applied as often as possible ... The torque converter clutch and/or gear clutches would have to slip for long periods under heavy loads to generate heat faster than it could be dissipated. ... The logical conclusion is that the torque converter is the culprit generating the extra heat.
... Premium fuel increases the peak torque at 4500 RPM from 32.4 kg-m to 34 kg-m. The torque at the torque converter stall speed is increased from 30kg-m to 32.4 kg-m (~2400 RPM). Premium fuel in this speed range improves the torque margin which will increase the time spent in 5th gear with the torque converter in lock-up mode. ...
These two things being true, there is merit in CentexG2 suggestion. It may not fix the problem but it could help reduce how often it overheats.
 

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Discussion Starter #55
And, how often is this happening?
You're asking the wrong person Farther. I want to know the answer to that too, but until we know...
 

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Until I see some statics to verify this overheating problem I remain skeptical. I think you maybe in search of a solution to a nonexistent problem or one that is very low occurring. If you have to search this hard for a significant number of examples, you may have found your answer.
 

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Discussion Starter #57
Until I see some statics to verify this overheating problem I remain skeptical. I think you maybe in search of a solution to a nonexistent problem or one that is very low occurring. If you have to search this hard for a significant number of examples, you may have found your answer.
Honda's TSBs and the threads complaining about overheating should be plenty of evidence for educated owners/future byers to consider paying a little bit of attention to the issue; knowledge is power. The problem obviously exists (note the TSBs) but could be infrequent--I don't think many Gen2 owners are the type to really push their RLs to the limits for that's not its demographic (there's always a few of us that push things though).

This thread was started to see what can be gathered and learned about the potential issue. As time moves on, I hope more evidence will be gathered and shared. As that occurs, there is no reason ideas and technical information cannot be shared by others; again knowledge is power and sharing information and ideas on the ROC is what this platform is all about.
 

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I think you maybe in search of a solution to a nonexistent problem or one that is very low occurring.
IMO that's quite possible, especially the latter.

Please note that in my last post I referred to ".... the 2G tranny discussion", after deciding that ".... the 2g tranny issue" or "problem" would be inappropriately presumptuous at this point.

And I brought forward Mr. Flint's comments Re: premium fuel, not so much as a possible cure for a 'problem' (if indeed there even is one), but as a tool that towing owners might find beneficial for 'Gen2 trans temp management' (taking a cue from the thread title).

Whether there's a 'problem' or not, I suspect most would agree that managing tranny fluid temp (e.g. keeping it closer to 'normal', un-stressed ranges) likely offers both a short-term and a long-term "positive difference" (again from my previous post), especially if that "positive difference" (dare I say "benefit"?) can be achieved by something as simple and relatively economical as the use of premium fuel on an only-as-needed basis.
 

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Discussion Starter #59
Another user with an cooked trany: https://www.ridgelineownersclub.com/threads/transmission-overheated-while-towing.212800/page-3#post-3084167

It seams that slow speeds while towing in hot conditions (summer time) may be the driving condition that causes this issue to appear (that would fit the TFL example as well).

When I am towing with my Gen1, it's usually at speed with the only stop and go conditions being at a few stop lights here and there. If I were to hit commuter traffic towing, maybe my Gen1 would have the same overheat conditions with its 5AT, but since I avoid towing in those conditions, I don't know (I'm a summer weekend tower).
 

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It seems that slow speeds while towing in hot conditions (summer time) may be the driving condition that causes this issue to appear (that would fit the TFL example as well).
Agree that does seem to be the evolving evidence as we follow the posts.

Building on that, for owners who encounter those use-conditions, the 'solutions' seem to revolve around improving fluid cooling (and thereby tranny internals cooling). Strategies advanced for achieving that seem to be:

High Octane Fuel - not at all 'proven' for the 2G / 6AT but a possible aid to reduce fluid heating caused by fluid shear stress; this accomplished (perhaps) by altering engine power delivery and thereby allowing more favorable tranny shifting / lock-up behavior. This strategy could be employed in conjunction with others. This strategy would present no jeopardy to warranty claims.

Improve OEM cooler airflow
- again not 'proven', but IMO a reasonable intuitive response to a condition associated with low airflow over the OEM cooler. This might be accomplished by adding a fan dedicated to the OEM tranny cooler surface. If done without modification to the OEM components this would IMO arguably not jeopardize warranty claims.

Install an aftermarket tranny cooler - quite likely a successful strategy for improving fluid cooling if components are carefully chosen. May or may not include a dedicated tranny cooler fan. IMO this strategy carries a much greater risk of jeopardy to warranty claims.

The need for mitigation, and the degree (pardon) of success of any mitigating strategy or combination of strategies is likely closely related to the degree of stress that any particular owner encounters / imposes on their vehicle (magnitude, duration, and frequency?).

I mention warranty implications because for folks who may be within their original warranty or carry a HondaCare extended term warranty, but who would also prefer to pre-empt issues if possible, IMO that's a pertinent consideration.

It also strikes me that folks who anticipate encountering these particular stressful driving conditions might be well-advised to 1) install a device to monitor TFT; and, 2) replace tranny fluid promptly upon observing extreme TFT excursions (on the theory that heat-stressed fluid may lose some of it's beneficial characteristics).

Lots of opinion in that, but is that a reasonable summary of the situation as we now think we know it?

Always subject to revision as we learn more of course.
 
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