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Discussion Starter #1
Decided to do an oil analysis "just because" with 37.5k total miles and 9400 miles on oil.

2017 RTL, will be 2 years of ownership at the end of this month, and I'll be pushing 40k miles. I'm following the MM and have typically changed at 10%, which is roughly 9k miles for my mostly highway/freeway driving. They say I'm showing excessive metals.
@rrudd2 is the only other member to which I found via search to have done this as well! We have similar high aluminium and copper.
rudd2 results
 

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and I forgot to take a sample to send in...and if I got a result like this, I would not be happy.
going CC in about 2 weeks also.
 

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At least there is no shearing or fuel dilution due to the DI motor-that’s good news.

As far as the Al and Cu numbers go, yes they look elevated but Blackstone compares to “universal” averages and if their dataset is small for this application then any data that is outside of the average-farther from the center of the bell curve-may seem out of place until a more complete dataset is known.

I wouldn’t worry too much based on a single test at this point. Additionally even with the age of your RL, the mileage isn’t that great-these ‘could’ still be leftover or continuing break in levels.

Here are a couple UOA’s from similar Honda J35’s on BITOG that show metals in line with yours.

https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/4898715/Searchpage/1/Main/297987/Words/%2BUoa+%2BRidgeline+%2B/Search/true/re-first-used-oil-analysis-2018-odyssey-3-5-v6-earth-dreams-di#Post4898715

https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/4744999/Searchpage/1/Main/288500/Words/%2B+%2Bpilot/Search/true/re-mobil1-0w20ep-blend-5k-mi-17-honda-pilot-20k#Post4744999

https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/4636265/Searchpage/2/Main/281728/Words/%2B+%2Bpilot/Search/true/re-mobil-1-afe-0w20-3683-honda-pilot-2016#Post4636265
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I actually am not too worried at this point either. I will however likly do an oil only change at 50% on the MM, and following the MM otherwise. And pointing out the universal averages... their data set is likely still small. In the 4 week time span between rrudd2 and my samples, the universal averages changed ever so slightly.
 

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With that Calcium value, you don’t have to worry about your Ridgeline getting Osteoporosis :)
 

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For those who analyze their oil, what are you doing about the results? Driving an 07 RL with 112k.
 

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I've followed Bob is the oil guy website in previous years. Truth is that you don't need to monitor your oil if everything is going fine and you are following the recommendations of the manufacturer. The real reason to follow it is for commercial vehicles to determine when the oil is worn out on extended change intervals. Also, on machines like my tractor which has been in service for 38 years it's a good idea to do some oil testing and see what the internals are wearing like. The alarms bells would go off if my wear is getting high in metals for the main bearings or aluminum buildup from pistons or high brass. A rebuild might be necessary to keep it from breaking down next season during peak grass cutting time. Otherwise in cars nobody keeps them long enough and does enough testing to make it worth it.

My 2cents on it after following Bob for several years on the oil stuff.

Steve (sent in my oil sample from my 1980 Ford 1900 this past Monday... waiting on the results)
 

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So what does this mean, change the oil earlier or the Copper and Aluminum would be high anyway?
No idea. LOL. If I were to assume a linear wear rate, if you adjust my miles to their universal averages, I'd "only" be at 57/58% higher than their mean. Which is not exactly more than "twice" when speaking relative wear. Under the assumption of linear wear though... if I changed it earlier, I'd expect that much less metal in the oil. Not sure how much of these elements get stuck in filters though.... all just speculation. And interesting that Mn is 11 in my sample, but typically 1. By their calling Al in my sample 9, as more than twice the universal average of 4, I'd expect perhaps a mention? What would be more interesting is if the universal averages had standard deviations attached to see what the range typically is.

For those who analyze their oil, what are you doing about the results? Driving an 07 RL with 112k.
Nothing much really other than looking at it for curiosity. I'll be changing oil one extra time in between, but that's about it... but I was going to do that before I did the oil test anyway "just in case". It's not a lot of work for me since I just pump it out the top, or if I wanted to drain from the bottom, I fit under the truck without needing to jack it up.
 

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IMHO these ^ analyses, indicate (to me) that the oil weight chosen by the Honda Motor Company to perform well in CAFE testing is not the best choice for this engine in this application. I said the same thing years ago when Honda recommended 5W-20 weight oil for the 2-liter motor in the '02-'05 Civic Si. Almost immediately owners of the '02 Si's began reporting incidents of camshaft galling. It was apparent (to me) then that that community of (ahem) "enthusiasts" were working that engine for all it was worth, and that the 5W-20 weight (conventional) motor oil that HMC was recommending for that application simply wasn't up to the task. (This despite the fact that HMC continued to recommend an HTO certified 5W-30 weight oil for the 2-liter motor in the RSX-S.) I recommended the same oil for the EP3. Was I correct? Beats me, but the number of reported camshaft failures definitely declined over time. Whether than was due to my oh-so-humble efforts to inform the EP3 community or (more likely) metallurgical improvements or other mechanical improvements made by the manufacturer, I have no idea.

In any case, these results would be enough to motivate me to chose a higher viscosity/weight oil in this application.
 

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IMHO these ^ analyses, indicate (to me) that the oil weight chosen by the Honda Motor Company to perform well in CAFE testing is not the best choice for this engine in this application. I said the same thing years ago when Honda recommended 5W-20 weight oil for the 2-liter motor in the '02-'05 Civic Si. Almost immediately owners of the '02 Si's began reporting incidents of camshaft galling. It was apparent (to me) then that that community of (ahem) "enthusiasts" were working that engine for all it was worth, and that the 5W-20 weight (conventional) motor oil that HMC was recommending for that application simply wasn't up to the task. (This despite the fact that HMC continued to recommend an HTO certified 5W-30 weight oil for the 2-liter motor in the RSX-S.) I recommended the same oil for the EP3. Was I correct? Beats me, but the number of reported camshaft failures definitely declined over time. Whether than was due to my oh-so-humble efforts to inform the EP3 community or (more likely) metallurgical improvements or other mechanical improvements made by the manufacturer, I have no idea.

In any case, these results would be enough to motivate me to chose a higher viscosity/weight oil in this application.
Wouldn't deviating from their recommended oil void the warranty?
The Magnuson–Moss Warranty Act would likely come into effect and it would be on Honda to prove that a higher viscosity/weight caused a failure where the engine warranty comes into play. In reality I'd bet 10% of vehicles changed at dealerships are not getting the appropriate spec of oil.
 

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This is why I use premium synthetic and change the oil at 10%, I could care less what the warranty or recommended nonsense says, use the highest quality synthetics and change them proactively. I use amsoil signature series.

https://540ratblog.wordpress.com/2013/06/20/motor-oil-wear-test-ranking/
"For reference, at the time of this writing Amsoil 5W30 Signature Series, produced 134,352 psi, and is ranked 2nd for oils “just as they come, right out of the bottle” (only Amsoil 0W20 Signature Series, was able to slightly beat it), out of 223 oils tested so far. And Amsoil 10W30 Dominator Racing oil, produced a far lower 97,118psi, is ranked 62nd. The higher the psi value an oil can produce, the better the wear protection."

2. 0W20 Amsoil Signature Series, synthetic = 134,840 psi
The bottle does not have an API symbol, but it claims the oil can be used in applications that require API SN, GM dexos 1, ACEA A1/B1. It also claims to provide 75% better wear protection than required by the API SN specification. And it claims 50% more cleaning power than Amsoil OE motor oil.
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD
This oil was tested Fall 2017. And it produced the highest psi value ever seen in my testing, from “ANY” motor oil just as it comes right out of the bottle, with no aftermarket additives. Very impressive. My test results confirm that Amsoil’s claim of this oil providing exceptional wear protection, is true. And this is further proof that you do NOT need heavy thick viscosity to provide such impressive wear protection.
 

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So what does this mean, change the oil earlier or the Copper and Aluminum would be high anyway?
Pleased to see low Fuel dilution.

Copper and aluminum would be high anyway and likely will be for at least a few sumps.

It takes a while to flush these down - go on bitog and read a few break-in uoas and you will see this is the norm for these metals to stick around for a couple of sumps or more.

Of course, its got a lot of iron and aluminum in it - its only a few sumps from your break in run and you ran it 9K+ - no surprise here considering you leave a bit in between flushes with hondas A/B filter on top of all the nooks and crannies in the mill.


I see no surprises at all.


In addition to normal maintenance you are performing the stock oils filters aren't very efficient- there are upgrades available to you for very small increments of money.

Drop a mag on the filter or put some neodymiums in the inlet dome and take a look at what you get out of the oil.

A strong magnet solution is worth between 1 and 3 iso code drops in cleanliness - cheapest bump in filtration performance you can get.

UD
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Decided to run another Blackstone report on oil ~40k , 1.5 years, and 7 changes after the first run. After the first report, I changed oil at 50% MM three times (without re-setting the MM), and let the report oil go the full 100-0% duration before taking the sample. Since this report looks reasonable, I will likely go back to waiting till 0-5% on the MM before changing oil/filter. Will probably send another oil sample in two years or so, at 120k.
403694
 

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Well, I guess that sums it up for a highway driver. Wonder if a better filter would have made a difference in the reporting. Probably all within a confidence interval anyway.
 

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No, UOAs don't show differences in filters. They don't show differences in oils, either. They're not that type of tool.
 
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