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We still own two vehicles that are over 50 years old, and there are many others out there even older. How many "modern" vehicles will still be around 50 years plus after their manufacture?

Bill
You're an outlier. The vast majority of people neither own nor have any desire to own a 50 year-old automobile.

"Research by R.L. Polk says that the average age of a modern vehicle is 11.4 years, while the average length of time drivers keep a new vehicle is 71.4 months — around 6 years."

Very few people will care if a 2020 Honda Ridgeline is still on the road in 2070. Why over-engineer a vehicle to last 50 years when the average person will only keep it for 6 years?

Do you still watch the evening news on a 50 year-old television?

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I've been buying cars for a long time. I would NEVER EVER WANT an old car again. (as new at least). Those old things sucked. More than a few times I would get a new car and they just weren't good off the lot. Most of the time I just would wait till the first oil change as if the rattles and noises didn't quit by then the dealership would fix them. Most of the time they weren't interested in even looking at it with only 500mi on it. So, at each oil change I'd ask them to fix whatever it was. Sometimes it took 2 or 3 oil changes for them to fix them all. Sometimes I'd just hit 50k or 60k miles (usually in two years) and then I'd just trade it in "broken". I would always tell the receiving dealer about the issues and that their dealership usually "didn't" fix them. The guy would look at me funny like WTF lol and I'd just get the new keys and leave. But, as time has passed by and many new cars later the later and newer ones would be better quality vehicles with less need for those oil change repairs. This Ridgeline while I don't drive as much anymore due to my job change, has almost 40,000mi and I have not had a repair needed yet. I did just the last couple of days put the ELM scanner on it to see what the fuel trims look like (seeing if they are excessive and with "hidden" fuel codes not reported yet) but all has been good. Not a single error in there to worry about. And the fuel trims are good too at around 3-4% at idle and over 520lbs of fuel pressure which i would say looks good.

Anyway, cars are better than ever. And even the radio systems which were really horrible in the 70's cars are fantastic compared to low quality they stuck in them then. (mostly AM radios standard and FM was optional along with a second upgrade to FM Stereo ! ) Want a tape player ? 8 track only ! (and they were JUNK) And don't even get me started on Carburetors! They were just plain crap in the 70's with emissions junk on them. I fondly remember our 1982 Pontiac Trans am with the 305 and the solenoid activated and computer controlled idle circuit. I actually bought the factory manual for that car so i could read up on how they were implementing computers in them for the O2 feedback loops. Was actually kinda interesting but not really ! lol

The best carb I ever saw was the one on the 64' Landrover. It was basically a tube which "squirted" gas out into a "vortex" area of rushing air. This was the "atomization" procedure used to "vaporize" the gas into the intake area. It was a unreal and basic method for fuel delivery. Of course that carb never failed to work in 14 years. It was just too simple ! Long live the Solex carb!


Steve
 

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No we don't but Ruthie who's 97 down the street from us does ! And hers failed the sound recently. I unplugged it and plugged it back in and poof! It started working again. But the truth is that if that set ever quit working I could FIX IT. Yes, I know the technology is old but the real only limiting factor is availability of parts. Descrete components as used in these sets just for the most part are long gone. And yes, hers is a RCA.

Steve

You're an outlier. The vast majority of people neither own nor have any desire to own a 50 year-old automobile.

"Research by R.L. Polk says that the average age of a modern vehicle is 11.4 years, while the average length of time drivers keep a new vehicle is 71.4 months — around 6 years."

Very few people will care if a 2020 Honda Ridgeline is still on the road in 2070. Why over-engineer a vehicle to last 50 years when the average person will only keep it for 6 years?

Do you still watch the evening news on a 50 year-old television?

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Old TVs were awful. A good set in the 70’s cost hundreds of dollars, in 70’s money, and the picture quality sucked, and they had people who made a living fixing them because they were unreliable, just like cars were then. Nowadays, if your 50 inch flat screen fails ( which hardly ever happens), you can get a brand new one for less inflation adjusted dollars than one trip from the tv repairman in the 70’s would have cost you. As for cars, I’ll restate the old saw that they only had five digit odometers for a reason. If I had a teenage kid there is no way I’d want them to drive any of the piles of $&[email protected] that I drove in high school. 😛
 

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If it was made to be possible, would I consider buying an old classic new right off the assembly line today just as they were built in their prime?? El Camino? Chevelle? Corvette? Challenger? Superbird? Apache? C/K pickup, Silverado? Powerwagon?

In a heartbeat!!

Bill
 

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If it was made to be possible, would I consider buying an old classic new right off the assembly line today just as they were built in their prime?? El Camino? Chevelle? Corvette? Challenger? Superbird? Apache? C/K pickup, Silverado? Powerwagon?

In a heartbeat!!

Bill
I respect the nostalgia, but I'd love to see the look on your face when some teenager in his mom's Camry smoked you from a red light or lost you around a corner in any of those muscle cars you mentioned. ;)
 

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I respect the nostalgia, but I'd love to see the look on your face when some teenager in his mom's Camry smoked you from a red light or lost you around a corner in any of those muscle cars you mentioned. ;)
Your and my priorities are obviously totally different, zroger73. For the sake of this thread, as an example, a 1970 Chevy K10 pickup could be had for $2,500, today that is the equivalent of approximately $16,000, 1/3-1/2 the cost of a new Ridgeline today.

Bill
 

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Your and my priorities are obviously totally different, zroger73. For the sake of this thread, as an example, a 1970 Chevy K10 pickup could be had for $2,500, today that is the equivalent of approximately $16,000, 1/3-1/2 the cost of a new Ridgeline today.

Bill
I can't disagree with that - I don't represent the average buyer, either. It's foolish of me to trade vehicles every year - something that very few people do, but I do a lot of things that the vast majority of buyers don't. :)

A Ridgeline is quite a different beast than a Chevrolet K10. A more fair comparison would be a 2020 Chevrolet Silverado 1500 2WD, regular cab, long bed work truck like this one that can be purchased for $22,000 or less.

The extra $6,000 over a 1970 model buys you a lot...

Power steering
Power brakes
Air conditioning
Anti-look brakes
Traction and stability control
Air bags
Seat belts
More power
Better fuel economy
Lower emissions
Batter safety
Automatic transmission
Touch screen infotainment system
Tilt steering wheel
USB port
Four wheel disc brakes
Stainless steel exhaust system
Bluetooth hands-free calling
Backup camera
Tire pressure monitoring system
Automatic headlights
Better rustproofing
Smoother ride
Quieter interior
Much lower maintenance requirements
Much longer life between rebuilds

A 1970 Chevrolet truck came standard with none of those features and was likely backed by a 12-month,12,000-mile warranty that was typical of the era.
 

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A 1970 Chevrolet truck came standard with none of those features and was likely backed by a 12-month,12,000-mile warranty that was typical of the era.
HMMMMMMMMMMMMM.................I think that was my point, zroger73? :unsure:

Complexity, modern vehicles are getting more complex every year, and THAT is the problem. Do you want the reliability of vehicles of the past, then get rid of all of the electronics and comforts of modern vehicles, making them "simple" once again, and quality will automatically improve. This is our, the consumers, fault for demanding these comforts, the manufacturers can only do so much and keep a vehicle cheap enough so to compete. Just think of how much more manufacturers could put into a vehicle if they used the same money now used for complex "niceties" and build it into the quality?

Bill
Bill
 

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I think you guys are talking about the wrong eras. The 70s and most of the 80s were really bad in terms of reliability for most cars. All the switching to FWD, 4 speed transmissions, and computerized fuel injection in the 80s resulted in a lot of problems. It wasn't until the 90s that they started to get it straight and we had some really reliable cars emerge. One of those was the V6 mustangs of the mid to late 90s (up to early 2000s). Other obvious ones are the early 90s Civics and Accords. All of those cars just run forever, I still see quite a few on the road..

I'd even give a nod to the first gen of the new mustangs with the 4.0. The power-train on those cars is an easy 200K miles - many of them far more. The engine was made for the Explorer, a vehicle which weighs about 800lbs more. I don't think the new ecoboost mustangs will do those kind of miles consistently.

For that matter, GM / Chevy pickup trucks and full size SUVs from about 2000 to 2006 (esp with the 5.3) are among the most long term reliable I've see. That is before they started putting cylinder deactivation, VVT, and loads of superfluous electronics in them. You still see tons of these on the road today.
 

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One of my friends told me this past weekend he needs to get his engine rebuilt or replaced in his 2013 GM truck. Can't remember if it's a Sierra or Silverado but it was a fairly high trim one if I remember correctly.
 

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Honda has been too compartmentalized for too long resulting in the right hand not knowing what the left hand is doing.

Profits across the industry are becoming so thin that partnerships are being formed just so automakers can stay afloat.

Honda wants to remain independent and do things their own way, but these same principles are limiting their growth, stifling innovation, cutting profits, and lowering quality. It's past time for a change.
Perhaps Honda agrees?

 

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Perhaps Honda agrees?

I hope this improves HMA QA/QC! I would like them to go a step further and have the Powersports division show the Autos division how to inject a little more excitement into their cars/trucks.
 

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Consumer Reports released their latest predicted reliability ratings based on reader surveys yesterday.

Mazda knocked Lexus off the perch to take the number 1 spot with a score of 83. The MX-5 Miata continues to be the most reliable model they have data on from any brand with a score of 98.

Lincoln was dead last at number 26 with a score of 8. Ouch.

Honda rose two spots behind Buick, Lexus, Toyota, and Mazda. CR attributed the improvement to models other than those coming out of Honda Manufacturing of Alabama where the Ridgeline and its engine (and 6-speed transmission, previously) are made. They show the Passport, Odyssey, and Pilot as Honda's three least reliable models. The Ridgeline scored a bit higher. The most reliable Honda model was the HR-V.
 

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Consumer Reports released their latest predicted reliability ratings based on reader surveys yesterday.

Mazda knocked Lexus off the perch to take the number 1 spot with a score of 83. The MX-5 Miata continues to be the most reliable model they have data on from any brand with a score of 98.

Lincoln was dead last at number 26 with a score of 8. Ouch.

Honda rose two spots behind Buick, Lexus, Toyota, and Mazda. CR attributed the improvement to models other than those coming out of Honda Manufacturing of Alabama where the Ridgeline and its engine (and 6-speed transmission, previously) are made. They show the Passport, Odyssey, and Pilot as Honda's three least reliable models. The Ridgeline scored a bit higher. The most reliable Honda model was the HR-V.
Did not expect Tesla to be second from last. It seems the larger vehicles drag even Toyota down, wonder if that's related to the activities larger vehicles are used for. RL scored a bit higher than the Tacoma.
 

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I, too, was a bit surprised to learn that Tesla's quality is at the bottom of the barrel from multiple sources earlier this year. I suppose I've been blinded by the "gee whiz" factor and performance of Tesla models and not being a Tesla owner and not knowing anyone who owns one, haven't experienced any of the issues first hand.
 

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Mazda is enjoying great reliability because they have been resisting going to the latest tech and its inherent growing pains.

Others, such as Lincoln, are striving to give their customers all the latest in technology, including the latest in engine 'improvements'.

I think Honda had jumped the gun on some of their tech a few years ago, and they are now starting to get a handle on things like their Safety Sensing suite (they have recently been approved for Level 3 autonomy in several countries, including Japan Honda wins world's 1st approval for level-3 autonomous vehicle ).
 

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Valid point. I remember when Hondas were behind the curve in terms of cutting-edge technology. Their focus was on quality, durability, simplicity, and efficiency. They didn't adopt the latest styling trends, but their designs didn't age very quickly, either.

Then, around the mid-2010s they started going all in on the latest tech. I think they lost focus of the core values that made a Honda a Honda as they tried to compete with other brands. It seems to me that's when quality started to decline.
 

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Tesla quality is horrendous. It's hilarious to see people on this site complain about panel gaps when compared to a Tesla. There have been cases of Tesla body panels missing clearcoat and just not painted. Window trim molding missing, etc. I'll buy a Tesla once they improve their quality. There have been instances where people have refused deliveries, upwards of three times! And we're not talking about unrealistic expectations. We're talking about major flaws.
 
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