Honda Ridgeline Owners Club Forums banner

1 - 20 of 52 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
52 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Have some fire roads/jeep trails I need to get up. The roads are rocky and sandy and the slope appears to be around 20 to 25 degrees (iphone readout).

I think the truck will make it but has anyone used theirs on the jeep trails in SoCal OC mountains enough to form any opinions?

Thanks
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,253 Posts
Have some fire roads/jeep trails I need to get up. The roads are rocky and sandy and the slope appears to be around 20 to 25 degrees (iphone readout).

I think the truck will make it but has anyone used theirs on the jeep trails in SoCal OC mountains enough to form any opinions?

Thanks
if I remember correctly, the approach angle of the G2 is 21 degrees...but if it is a gradual approach you only have to worry about the surface. Loose rocks? No way will it make it. Sand? Not likely, but hard pack dirt, should make it easy.

Gotta love google.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
784 Posts
Have some fire roads/jeep trails I need to get up. The roads are rocky and sandy and the slope appears to be around 20 to 25 degrees (iphone readout).

I think the truck will make it but has anyone used theirs on the jeep trails in SoCal OC mountains enough to form any opinions?

Thanks

I highly doubt the slope is 20-25 degrees. You might mean a 20-25% grade??

Even a 20% grade is extremely steep. Do-able on paved surface if taken slow/low gear. Unpaved, and traction will be the determining factor.

-
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
52 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
These trails are steep when they go up the sides of hills rather than follow a canyon! For me its a killer walk up and I need to get tools an people up there. Some of the people probably arent willing/able to make the walk due to steepness of trail. This particular trail doesnt have a lot of loose stuff just light sand over soft weathered sandstone.

I guess I dont know the difference between slope and grade. What I tried to say is the trails inclination angle is 20-25 degrees...not percent. Zero degrees is flat land and 90 degrees is a vertical rock face. Just beyond where I need to get to has a 35-40 degree inclination and I have no intention of ever trying that in the truck!

To measure degrees I just set the phone on the hillside and use the compass app to give me the degrees it is angled. Really useful since I can get a repeatable measurement anytime.

Out of curiosity I looked around and found this:
Bicyclists, motorists, carpenters, roofers and others either need to calculate slope or at least must have some understanding of it.
Slope, tilt or inclination can be expressed in three ways:
1) As a ratio of the rise to the run (for example 1 in 20)
2) As an angle (almost always in degrees)
3) As a percentage called the "grade" which is the (rise ÷ run) * 100.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
784 Posts
These trails are steep when they go up the sides of hills rather than follow a canyon! For me its a killer walk up and I need to get tools an people up there. Some of the people probably arent willing/able to make the walk due to steepness of trail. This particular trail doesnt have a lot of loose stuff just light sand over soft weathered sandstone.

I guess I dont know the difference between slope and grade. What I tried to say is the trails inclination angle is 20-25 degrees...not percent. Zero degrees is flat land and 90 degrees is a vertical rock face. Just beyond where I need to get to has a 35-40 degree inclination and I have no intention of ever trying that in the truck!

To measure degrees I just set the phone on the hillside and use the compass app to give me the degrees it is angled. Really useful since I can get a repeatable measurement anytime.

Out of curiosity I looked around and found this:
Bicyclists, motorists, carpenters, roofers and others either need to calculate slope or at least must have some understanding of it.
Slope, tilt or inclination can be expressed in three ways:
1) As a ratio of the rise to the run (for example 1 in 20)
2) As an angle (almost always in degrees)
3) As a percentage called the "grade" which is the (rise ÷ run) * 100.

As a VERY rough rule of thumb, % grade or slope is roughly double the incline as measured in degrees. So a 10 degree incline would yield ABOUT 20% grade/slope (again, that is a very rough conversion for simplicity sake.)

To put that in perspective a 20% grade (10-11 degree incline) is TREMENDOUSLY steep. There are very few paved roads in the world that have a slope like that. Out on the highways, if you encounter an 8% grade (around 3-4 degrees of incline), it is considered darn steep.

You mentioned that 90 degrees is vertical. This is true. But as far as human mobility is concerned, 45 degrees may as well be vertical, too. If you were to stand at the top of a 45 degree incline, you would feel as though you were looking over the edge of a cliff. If you tried to walk down that incline and tripped, you wouldn't fall on the ground and stop right there, you would just keep tumbling down until you hit the bottom.

A typical residential stairway is around 30 degrees incline. If you ramped that, you would not dare try to walk down it. No production automobile could drive up or down it (at least, not with any margin of safety.)

It can be hard to tell from video, but in the Ridgeline off-road video above, I did not see any inclines that were over maybe 10-12 degrees (20-25% slope). Even those were pretty quick short hills. My guess is even capable off-road vehicles would be SEVERELY challenged on inclines of any significant length with inclines over about 15 degrees or so.

-
 
  • Like
Reactions: NSIDER

·
Registered
Joined
·
417 Posts
I've walked on a race track with 20+ degree banking, and it's a challenge to walk up! You can basically reach your hand straight out, and touch the asphalt in front of your face. There is some formula for the degree of banking vs. the speed the car becomes "neutral" , meaning no steering correction to keep the car straight. This particular track was ~150mph neutral @ 26 degrees. I also got to drive on it, but was shy of 150, so I stayed down lower in the bank. My car was maxed at ~130. It was more of a drag car anyway, so 130 was more than enough! Literally thought it was going to come apart at any minute...:surprise:

But back closer to the off-road topic, I have a couple ~15% grades on my hunting land, and if the trail is a bit wet, it's all my truck wants in 4L with diff lock engaged. Of course, tires would play a huge roll also, and my Wranglers aren't so hot off-road. Some KO2's would help immensely.

At any rate, one does need to be extremely careful navigating steep grades. Things can get out of hand very quickly.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Last Train

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,505 Posts
I highly doubt the slope is 20-25 degrees. You might mean a 20-25% grade??

Even a 20% grade is extremely steep. Do-able on paved surface if taken slow/low gear. Unpaved, and traction will be the determining factor.

-
As a VERY rough rule of thumb, % grade or slope is roughly double the incline as measured in degrees. So a 10 degree incline would yield ABOUT 20% grade/slope (again, that is a very rough conversion for simplicity sake.)

To put that in perspective a 20% grade (10-11 degree incline) is TREMENDOUSLY steep. There are very few paved roads in the world that have a slope like that. Out on the highways, if you encounter an 8% grade (around 3-4 degrees of incline), it is considered darn steep.

You mentioned that 90 degrees is vertical. This is true. But as far as human mobility is concerned, 45 degrees may as well be vertical, too. If you were to stand at the top of a 45 degree incline, you would feel as though you were looking over the edge of a cliff. If you tried to walk down that incline and tripped, you wouldn't fall on the ground and stop right there, you would just keep tumbling down until you hit the bottom.

A typical residential stairway is around 30 degrees incline. If you ramped that, you would not dare try to walk down it. No production automobile could drive up or down it (at least, not with any margin of safety.)

It can be hard to tell from video, but in the Ridgeline off-road video above, I did not see any inclines that were over maybe 10-12 degrees (20-25% slope). Even those were pretty quick short hills. My guess is even capable off-road vehicles would be SEVERELY challenged on inclines of any significant length with inclines over about 15 degrees or so.

-
I find it hard to "picture" a 12 degrees slope is a steep slope...just picturing a horizontal line and even the 20 degrees picture below looks just barely steep to me.

also:


What about the streets of San Francisco ?:smile: ...They're very steep...what degrees do you think they are ?

anyway...what angle/degrees do you think these hills are ?? picture is from that link article that "Tidewater BE" posted above...looks to me they are like 25-30 degrees...maybe even more ?.. :|:nerd:
2016 Midsize Pickup Challenge: Off-Road Performance - PickupTrucks.com News
~~~



~~~~~
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
784 Posts
I find it hard to "picture" a 12 degrees slope is a steep slope...just picturing a horizontal line and even the 20 degrees picture below looks just barely steep to me.

also:


What about the streets of San Francisco ?:smile: ...They're very steep...what degrees do you think they are ?

anyway...what angle/degrees do you think these hills are ?? picture is from that link article that "Tidewater BE" posted above...looks to me they are like 25-30 degrees...maybe even more ?.. :|:nerd:
2016 Midsize Pickup Challenge: Off-Road Performance - PickupTrucks.com News
~~~



~~~~~

I haven't read the articles in those links, but looking at the photos you posted those appear to be +/- 20% slopes (maybe), or around 10-11 degree inclines.

I know, it is hard to believe. Most would estimate the incline as greater than that. But that is how humans perceive inclines -- they naturally greatly over-estimate them.

Like I said earlier, if you were standing at the top of a 45 degree incline, you would process/perceive it as a precipice. Effectively it is -- trip on that sort of incline and down you go to the bottom. Even a 30 degree incline is scary and you wouldn't want to negotiate it on foor for any great distance without safety ropes.

Do a test in your own home and imagine the stairway with a ramp on it. Now imagine that ramp extending for a hundred feet instead of just 15 or twenty. That's what a 30-35 degree incline would look like.

I have negotiated a paved 23% slope/grade (around 12 degree incline). The photos of that road appear dramatically steeper than the photos presented here (above). It is just the nature of how 2-dimensional photos capture height and depth, and also how our brains process the information.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,505 Posts
You're telling me..if I were to look at those hill from a side view and use the flat ground to pictured a triangle to do the math... the 2 pics I'd posted would be 12 degrees or less ?? ??

I don't know what math you are using or maybe we are not speaking the same language or not using the same POV... but that side view of those hills would be more steeper then this picture that was posted earlier ! .. wouldn't it ??





I haven't read the articles in those links, but looking at the photos you posted those appear to be +/- 20% slopes (maybe), or around 10-11 degree inclines.

I know, it is hard to believe. Most would estimate the incline as greater than that. But that is how humans perceive inclines -- they naturally greatly over-estimate them.

Like I said earlier, if you were standing at the top of a 45 degree incline, you would process/perceive it as a precipice. Effectively it is -- trip on that sort of incline and down you go to the bottom. Even a 30 degree incline is scary and you wouldn't want to negotiate it on foor for any great distance without safety ropes.

Do a test in your own home and imagine the stairway with a ramp on it. Now imagine that ramp extending for a hundred feet instead of just 15 or twenty. That's what a 30-35 degree incline would look like.

I have negotiated a paved 23% slope/grade (around 12 degree incline). The photos of that road appear dramatically steeper than the photos presented here (above). It is just the nature of how 2-dimensional photos capture height and depth, and also how our brains process the information.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
784 Posts
Here's a 35 degrees/70% climb...it's steep...yet looks way less steep than those 2 pictures posted earlier from the review.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwhNZ9QJXAU

That is impressive and STEEP. But notice that was a special controlled course, with saftety rails, perfect approach and departures, and optimal surface traction. And the Land Rover (one of the best off-road vehicles made?) had to ascend at a snail pace in crawl mode, going straight up (no side-to-side anglling) the perfectly prepared surface.



You're telling me..if I were to look at those hill from a side view and use the flat ground to pictured a triangle to do the math... the 2 pics I'd posted would be 12 degrees or less ?? ??

I don't know what math you are using or maybe we are not speaking the same language or not using the same POV... but that side view of those hills would be more steeper then this picture that was posted earlier ! .. wouldn't it ??



Not likely. Again, our minds interpret a much steeper incline than reality. Combine that with the lack of 3D depth in photos and the inclne gets further exagerated.


Let's do another experiment. Tell me what you would estimate the DEGREE of incline to be in this photo:
 

Attachments

  • Like
Reactions: zroger73

·
Registered
Joined
·
784 Posts
In the photo immediately above that is a cyclist riding up the steepest section of the Mt Washington Auto Road. If you stand at the bottom of that section and look up, you would seriously hesitate to drive your vehicle up it. Yes, it can be done, but it is daunting.

This section is at the very top and is not open to private vehicles that pay to ascend the Auto Road. They park in a lower parking lot and hike the remainder of the way on stariways.

Look again at the photo. Is it 15, 20, or 30 degrees of incline??? None of the above. It is a 23% slope/grade. About 12 degrees of incline. And that is a documented fact.

-
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
257 Posts
As a land surveyor, i am constantly dealing with grades and slopes. After years of constantly over-estimating the steepness of slopes, imo ISO TRUCK is spot on with his analysis. Even knowing the facts that he has presented, i still WANT to say that those pictures look more like 25 degrees, or 50% slope, but i actually think he is right about them being more like half of that, or somewhere around 12 degrees or 25%slope.

I actually still have no idea what the actual slopes are, but am very aware of the phenomena he is describing. Maybe a good rule of thumb for me would be to estimate a slope, and then divide my estimate by two. Embarrassingly, i think doing this would get me a lot closer to the actual number........:)
 
1 - 20 of 52 Posts
Top