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Thanks for sharing that. Fascinating!
 

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Pretty sure thats the old nummi gm toyota plant. They were going to build new plant in detroit but decided to use the old ca plant.. Couldnt find rl assembly but the f150 aluminum has plenty of vids..
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Interesting. So why is it that they are expensive when machines do most of the work.
1) appeal to the wealthy
2) cosmetic & Industrial design
3) perceived value of electric vehicle
4) government subsidies
5) planet saving do gooders

In that order. :act024:
 

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Pretty sure thats the old nummi gm toyota plant. They were going to build new plant in detroit but decided to use the old ca plant.. Couldnt find rl assembly but the f150 aluminum has plenty of vids..
Yup, did a tour of the NUMMI plant in Fremont, CA when they were pumping out Tacomas and Corollas and GM Novas back in the 80's.

I don't think Tesla offers any tours, but those videos are great!
 

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1) appeal to the wealthy
2) cosmetic & Industrial design
3) perceived value of electric vehicle
4) government subsidies
5) planet saving do gooders

In that order. :act024:
Battery pack costs close to $30K all by itself. Vehicle is made with expensive materials and as a luxury car has an abundance of features that all add to the cost. It is also amazingly well engineered and executed (particularly for a "new kid on the block")

I wonder how much profit Tesla actually makes on its current vehicles?
 

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Pretty sure thats the old nummi gm toyota plant. They were going to build new plant in detroit but decided to use the old ca plant.. Couldnt find rl assembly but the f150 aluminum has plenty of vids..
Yes. Tesla got it at fire-sale prices after it was closed, including the stamping press. They cleaned up the interior, painted it white, and now it's awesome looking.

Chip H.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Battery pack costs close to $30K all by itself. Vehicle is made with expensive materials and as a luxury car has an abundance of features that all add to the cost. It is also amazingly well engineered and executed (particularly for a "new kid on the block")

I wonder how much profit Tesla actually makes on its current vehicles?
The silliness in my reply wasn't meant as a bash to the astounding advancements Elon Musk has made. The man is a true visionary. Space X AND Tesla? AMAZING accomplishments. No doubt the model S is a huge technology and materials leap forward. The pioneering work in battery construction, power management, mechanisms to exchange the power plant, the user interface on the giant center display - even the marketing, sales and distribution methods the company has pioneered - are turning the industry upside down. In a demented sort of way, its been interesting to see franchise dealerships file law suites in reaction to the Tesla business model.

Its difficult to believe information spread by (what passes for) media these days, even the financial press has taken to sensational headline grabbing "journalism". If financial news articles and industry analysis represent truth, the consensus is Tesla hasn't turned a profit yet.

A final thought: the nay sayers are focused on using public disgust in government to hammer the subsidy nail, and the establishment crowd are quick to point out certain negatives of electric vehicle - but it remains true battery chemistry is a problem in search of a meaningful solution. Sure, there are solutions in place but the recovery side of batteries lags production. I'm pretty sure Mr. Musk is working on that one and so are waste management capitalists.
 

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I hope they make a profit, not easy for such a high tech vehicle sold in low numbers.
Were it not for the cost of the batteries and the associated systems and components, it could sell for even a more reasonable price. I guess less expensive models are in the future if they can hold on. Still, nothing in it's class really comes close.

They had to know it would be difficult to incorporate the technology for less money, but to design it into a quality luxury automobile is a huge accomplishment for the money they are asking.
 

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I'm am anxious to see what the $35,000 Model 3 will offer assuming it becomes a reality.

I'd love to have a Model S, but simply can't justify spending that kind of money on a car - no matter how impressive it may be.
 

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Discussion Starter #17 (Edited)
This came across my desk recently, it got me to thinking about the awesome safety capabilities electric & hybrid vehicles must have to deal with this kind of thing.

Remember the news stories about "exploding laptops" and iPhones getting hot and/or burning the thigh of an owner carrying it in their front pocket? Early Li-Ion batteries had mass production related issues that were solved along the way, so we don't hear much about those things anymore.

Still, this is what happens when a manufacturing process goes slightly awry - and incompatible materials suddenly get into an unstoppable state of reaction.

Burnt1.jpg

What strikes me about that example is the intensity of the heat generated by this event. This is a 720mAh 3.7V Li-Ion in a small consumer device that can be carried in a pocket, on a key ring or whatever. The walls of the housing surrounding the battery and CCA inside are 3cm thick. The point of mentioning that is to convey how intense and focused the flame exiting the battery were. When I say focused, check out how the lower half of the unit reached a liquid state - then check out the red/black wires that were within a cm or so of a flame burning hot enough to liquefy some pretty stout plastic. The wires are virtually spotless! Image below provides a sense of the footprint of the device and battery.

20151006_134925_Hand.jpg

It took a pretty rare sequence of events to allow this burn event to happen - but it does happen.

Even though the construction of Tesla's 85kWh is VERY different than this little twin pack battery, should the stars align someday to release the full potential of something like the Tesla's power pack, I sure wouldn't want to be nearby.
 

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Correct they burn frequently, in the shipping yard, accidents, and road debris the most recent. The gov agreed to stop investigation as the agreed to add titanium plate under the car. Between tesla and solar company, we paid 5 billion in subsidies. I dont care for those buying i just do not want to pay for it..its pure crap. Billions in nasa..i get it we all benefit. The first cars were electric..big deal. Oh and its the worst possible polution not even green as it takes a lot of coal to burn to charge at a low efficiency..what bs..
 

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It might seem a little overkill, but a couple of weeks ago our vacuum cleaner (not by itself of course) ran over a cell phone battery charger winding the cord a few times around the roller. For kicks, after pulling the cord out from the roller, I plugged it in and put my meter on the output. It was still working fine with the now 'longer cord'. But I trashed it anyway, figuring if the insulation was stretched enough inside the output cord to expose any copper a short is a possibility as it gets used more. Heating up a circuit in a well sealed small module can be hazardous.
 
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