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1,817 Posts
Hey all you big brain RL people...
A brief history of recent service events before describing something odd and asking for your words of wisdom.
06 RL - 112,000 miles on the ODO
A while back the driver front wheel bearing began growling on slow sweeping right freeway curves. If she was headed straight - placing no steering related loads on components, there was no evidence of a bearing on its way out. Knowing front pads and discs were about to require attention, I waited until the pads audibly signaled their pending demise. Drove maybe 15K with the bearing growl that never seemed to get louder or change the way they announced their unhappiness.
Since bearing replacement requires disc & caliper removal, and I have no access to the appropriate press/tool to remove/insert bearings in knuckles, my shop of choice installed new OEM discs and pads I supplied for the low, low price of free. Which is nice. The shop uses only OEM parts, they supplied the bearings (cost of those = ouch). That work was completed last Tuesday, so Wednesday, Thursday & Friday were normal commute days. Other than noting the smells associated with pads and rotors cooking off manufacture residue, everything seemed good, save a visual observation of initial wear marks on the new disc/pad combo. More on that later.
Saturday morning, I ran over to the local Honda dealer to pick up a case of DW-1 (I found that if you talk shop with these guys, they'll compete with the best internet pricing). Upon return home, the engine compartment was allowed to cool down a enough to facilitate the first drain/fill after which I drove for maybe 50 miles then executed drain/fill #2. # 3 will be done next weekend. BTW: I hadta take pics of the drain plug because I was impressed by the texture and color of debris collected on the magnetic plug shaft. More on that later.
After driving the new brake/bearing parts for about 1.5 tanks of fuel miles, a new noise was observed. The first manifestation was during execution of a left turn @ the top of a FWY off ramp. It's best described as a mid frequency "whoosh" - definitely not a high frequency enough to be a "whine" but not low enough to be a "growl". No vibration was felt. At that time, the stereo was on, playing at a level where a conversation could be had but still enjoyably loud. I could hear the noise even with the stereo at that level and at first wondered if the sound was in the music being played. I turned it down & lowered the driver window to listen closely but didn't hear it again.
Yesterday, the sound reappeared after driving enough distance for everything to achieve normal operating temps. I observed 2 distinct behaviors. At first, the noise could be reproduced after a turn by swerving R/L within lane lines @ approx 20 MPH. But the reproduction was not reliably repeatable. Driving farther along, the noise could be heard and intermittently reproduced when headed in a straight line but only under acceleration or deceleration without applying the brakes. The sound does not manifest when maintaining a constant speed on flat ground. It's intermittent enough to be frustrating, and because the sound appears/disappears quickly, it can't be localized to the R or L side - but it's definitely coming from up front. Because of the way the sound manifests, I suspect a bearing issue because under the load of acceleration or unassisted deceleration it can sometimes be reproduced in the same way it can during left turns.
Although I know it would be bizarre if this sound was associated with the trans fluid exchange, I can't stop thinking about things like this:
The sound didn't occur until after D & F which makes me consider things like cavitation, fluid levels in the torque converter AND this observation: after drain # 2, the truck was started, backed out of the driveway and placed in D to head up my rather steep hill. There was a noticeable "weakness" in trans response - almost - but not exactly like one might experience with slipping clutches, sort of like the stall one might have in a higher reving torque converter - weary of doing anything to hurt my beloved RL tranny, I immediately backed into the driveway, put er' in D and sat for a few moments thinking perhaps new fluid needed to be better circulated before loading up the trans. Since that one (possibly paranoid) incident, the trans seems totally normal. Logic & experience tells me the sound I'm hearing is wheel bearing related but it ain't much of a stretch to suspect I'm misdiagnosing the root cause.
I'll be calling my shop of choice this morning to inform them of the sound I'm hearing but am hesitant to take the RL in for their diag - only because it's so intermittent. If they don't hear it, it isn't happening. I can see the service record now: "NTF". Not that my shop is difficult to deal with, on the contrary, the reason I go there for work I can't do is they are good guys, do great work and I happily spend my $ in this local small business.
Even though it is near-impossible to screw up the very simple task of exchanging trans fluid, I'm paranoid enough to be leery of myself. After all, other than making sure there are no leaks and levels are correct, WTH can go wrong? Paranoia + odd noise + unpredictable reproduction of odd noise = ?
So I'm looking to the guys who have generously provided everything this site can offer to assuage my paranoia and bring me back to earth.
I've got a bunch of thoughts about recent service @ independent shops, part pricing, radio talk show host/independent shop owners and such but I'll save that for later.
Any ideas?
A brief history of recent service events before describing something odd and asking for your words of wisdom.
06 RL - 112,000 miles on the ODO
A while back the driver front wheel bearing began growling on slow sweeping right freeway curves. If she was headed straight - placing no steering related loads on components, there was no evidence of a bearing on its way out. Knowing front pads and discs were about to require attention, I waited until the pads audibly signaled their pending demise. Drove maybe 15K with the bearing growl that never seemed to get louder or change the way they announced their unhappiness.
Since bearing replacement requires disc & caliper removal, and I have no access to the appropriate press/tool to remove/insert bearings in knuckles, my shop of choice installed new OEM discs and pads I supplied for the low, low price of free. Which is nice. The shop uses only OEM parts, they supplied the bearings (cost of those = ouch). That work was completed last Tuesday, so Wednesday, Thursday & Friday were normal commute days. Other than noting the smells associated with pads and rotors cooking off manufacture residue, everything seemed good, save a visual observation of initial wear marks on the new disc/pad combo. More on that later.
Saturday morning, I ran over to the local Honda dealer to pick up a case of DW-1 (I found that if you talk shop with these guys, they'll compete with the best internet pricing). Upon return home, the engine compartment was allowed to cool down a enough to facilitate the first drain/fill after which I drove for maybe 50 miles then executed drain/fill #2. # 3 will be done next weekend. BTW: I hadta take pics of the drain plug because I was impressed by the texture and color of debris collected on the magnetic plug shaft. More on that later.
After driving the new brake/bearing parts for about 1.5 tanks of fuel miles, a new noise was observed. The first manifestation was during execution of a left turn @ the top of a FWY off ramp. It's best described as a mid frequency "whoosh" - definitely not a high frequency enough to be a "whine" but not low enough to be a "growl". No vibration was felt. At that time, the stereo was on, playing at a level where a conversation could be had but still enjoyably loud. I could hear the noise even with the stereo at that level and at first wondered if the sound was in the music being played. I turned it down & lowered the driver window to listen closely but didn't hear it again.
Yesterday, the sound reappeared after driving enough distance for everything to achieve normal operating temps. I observed 2 distinct behaviors. At first, the noise could be reproduced after a turn by swerving R/L within lane lines @ approx 20 MPH. But the reproduction was not reliably repeatable. Driving farther along, the noise could be heard and intermittently reproduced when headed in a straight line but only under acceleration or deceleration without applying the brakes. The sound does not manifest when maintaining a constant speed on flat ground. It's intermittent enough to be frustrating, and because the sound appears/disappears quickly, it can't be localized to the R or L side - but it's definitely coming from up front. Because of the way the sound manifests, I suspect a bearing issue because under the load of acceleration or unassisted deceleration it can sometimes be reproduced in the same way it can during left turns.
Although I know it would be bizarre if this sound was associated with the trans fluid exchange, I can't stop thinking about things like this:
The sound didn't occur until after D & F which makes me consider things like cavitation, fluid levels in the torque converter AND this observation: after drain # 2, the truck was started, backed out of the driveway and placed in D to head up my rather steep hill. There was a noticeable "weakness" in trans response - almost - but not exactly like one might experience with slipping clutches, sort of like the stall one might have in a higher reving torque converter - weary of doing anything to hurt my beloved RL tranny, I immediately backed into the driveway, put er' in D and sat for a few moments thinking perhaps new fluid needed to be better circulated before loading up the trans. Since that one (possibly paranoid) incident, the trans seems totally normal. Logic & experience tells me the sound I'm hearing is wheel bearing related but it ain't much of a stretch to suspect I'm misdiagnosing the root cause.
I'll be calling my shop of choice this morning to inform them of the sound I'm hearing but am hesitant to take the RL in for their diag - only because it's so intermittent. If they don't hear it, it isn't happening. I can see the service record now: "NTF". Not that my shop is difficult to deal with, on the contrary, the reason I go there for work I can't do is they are good guys, do great work and I happily spend my $ in this local small business.
Even though it is near-impossible to screw up the very simple task of exchanging trans fluid, I'm paranoid enough to be leery of myself. After all, other than making sure there are no leaks and levels are correct, WTH can go wrong? Paranoia + odd noise + unpredictable reproduction of odd noise = ?
So I'm looking to the guys who have generously provided everything this site can offer to assuage my paranoia and bring me back to earth.
I've got a bunch of thoughts about recent service @ independent shops, part pricing, radio talk show host/independent shop owners and such but I'll save that for later.
Any ideas?
