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well, I hate to see that your opinion of the RL not being a real truck, I’ve owned a lot of 4x4 pickups from Ford, Chevy, and Dodge, and I also owned an 07 RL.. the RLwas as much of a truck as any I’ve owned if not more, it hauled more weight in the bed, rode a hell of a lot better than most, decent gas mileage and the best 4x4 system I ever had. I sold my truck after having it for 12 years, I leased a Ram 1500, it’s been a great truck but it’s not a RL. My neighbor purchased my Ridge and I see it everyday, shouldn’t have sold it. If I could find a lower mileage 2014 I would probably buy it, still don’t like the looks of the gen 2.
Looks take a 3rd row seat to driving dynamics and functionality. The sooner you get over it and get back in the Ridgeline, the happier you’ll be. They are dealing like hell on them now with point 9 financing
 

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Looks take a 3rd row seat to driving dynamics and functionality. The sooner you get over it and get back in the Ridgeline, the happier you’ll be. They are dealing like hell on them now with point 9 financing
My dislike for the GenII is more than just looks. Honda reduced the size of the trunk, and reduced the opening for the rear of the cab (take the GenI's rear doors off and take the GenII's rear doors off and the size of the access is night and day. Door checker hack can't change that) They also made the driving position / experience more car like with a lower seating postion and dash / console that envolopes you. Add to that no dash shelf and lower ground clearance too. . .

Combine this with the aesthetics of Minivan front end and the car / minivan dash and the direction Honda went is clearly towards the softer carlike end of the spectrum. Not my cup of tea or what I was hoping for.
 

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My dislike for the GenII is more than just looks. Honda reduced the size of the trunk, and reduced the opening for the rear of the cab (take the GenI's rear doors off and take the GenII's rear doors off and the size of the access is night and day. Door checker hack can't change that) They also made the driving position / experience more car like with a lower seating postion and dash / console that envolopes you. Add to that no dash shelf and lower ground clearance too. . .

Combine this with the aesthetics of Minivan front end and the car / minivan dash and the direction Honda went is clearly towards the softer carlike end of the spectrum. Not my cup of tea or what I was hoping for.
I hate that I agree with everything you've said.
 

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I hate that I agree with everything you've said.
Well, it appears that the majority of the buying public over time did/does not agree with this sentiment and Honda made the right decision by doing a redesign?

Yearsold
200542,593
200650,193
200742,795
200833,417
200916,464
201016,142
20119,759
201215,438
201317,723
201413,389
2015520
201623,668
201734,749
201830,592
201926,280
Bill
 

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Well, it appears that the majority of the buying public over time did/does not agree with this sentiment and Honda made the right decision by doing a redesign?

Yearsold
200542,593
200650,193
200742,795
200833,417
200916,464
201016,142
20119,759
201215,438
201317,723
201413,389
2015520
201623,668
201734,749
201830,592
201926,280
Bill
Toyota
Tacoma
2018245.659
2017198.124
2016191.631
2015179.562
2014155.041
2013159.485
2012141.353
2011110.705
2010106.198
2009111.824
2008144.655
2007173.238
2006178.351
2005168.831
2004152.932
2003154.154
2002151.960
2001161.983
2000147.295
1999155.476
1998152.770
1997138.558
1996141.094
199588.967
199411.051
 

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I believe that you are comparing apples to oranges, my friend. As I have stated before, we believe that Honda designed the Ridgeline to fill the small niche in the market as being comparable to the unique, car-like, (softer?), El Camino / Ranchero from the past, and thus the reason the Ridgeline appealed to us. If we had wanted a "real truck" we would have purchased one of the many "cookie cutter" models every other manufacturer is already offering, we would not have purchased a Ridgeline and then try to make it into something in which it was not really conceived.

Bill
 

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I believe that you are comparing apples to oranges, my friend. As I have stated before, we believe that Honda designed the Ridgeline to fill the small niche in the market as being comparable to the unique, car-like, (softer?), El Camino / Ranchero from the past, and thus the reason the Ridgeline appealed to us. If we had wanted a "real truck" we would have purchased one of the many "cookie cutter" models every other manufacturer is already offering, we would not have purchased a Ridgeline and then try to make it into something in which it was not really conceived.

Bill
GenI / GenII's are real trucks. No need for Honda to go cookie cutter. The basic Ridgeline concept is genius. It just needs to distance (regain some uniqueness) itself from the Pilot and regain / build up some of the trucky utility (bigger trunk, better rear access, deeper bed, greater ground clearance, interior storage etc) AND aesthetics.

I personally think this whole "niche" argument is nonsense. Honda should give a damn about the truck market and would be estatic to have a vehicle that sells half as well as the Tacoma.

Apples to oranges? I would venture to say the vast majority of Tacoma (not to mention most of the passenger truck market in general) use their vehicles exactly the same way as Ridge owners do. Little off roading, towing under 5k weight, and bed with cargo in it is the exception rather the rule. The truck is at least in part purchased for aesthetics and the idea of truck capabilities. . .With a proper budget and some good thinking, Honda could solve some the capability gap and all of the aesthetics while still maintaining all the plusses of the Ridgeline.

Certainly some would be turned off by more truck and less car just like many of us were by the opposite. I think you would gain ALOT more sales than you would lose.
 

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How about doing some further thinking about those that are looking for something more than an SUV, but are not interested in buying a "real" truck, the Ridgeline fits that niche perfectly, does it not? By making some very relatively cheap and basic design changes to their established SUVs, they are essentially expanding their SUV market with the Ridgeline, are they not? By tickling and teasing the fancy of those "real" men who's egos demand their owning a "real" truck, Honda is also adding those to their numbers with the Ridgeline, are they not? The Ridgeline was not conceived to stand alone as a "truck", but rather an extension of Honda's SUV line, for if Honda's goal was really in selling large numbers of "real trucks", then I believe that they would be doing and designing trucks just as you are describing, of which they are totally capable of manufacturing, otherwise.............................................................?

Bill
 

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I'll never understand why people get so defensive and protective of their opinions. It's a vehicle, that's all. My opinion can differ from anyone else's...we all have different needs in a vehicle. That doesn't mean anyone else's opinions are wrong, I just may not agree with them. I'm am also not going to tell someone that their opinions are wrong because they're not. We're all friends on here, and there's no reason to be disrespectful to one another. Please don't read anything I post in a condescending tone because that's not how i'm writing it.

I have a 1st gen. and I love it. I was looking forward to the 2nd gen thinking Honda would have improved upon their original design. But instead, they went in the complete opposite direction. Rather than increasing the ground clearance (or keeping it the same), they lowered it. Rather than making rear seat access better, they made it narrower. They shrank the size of the trunk (2nd gen trunk will not fit my camping gear) and they reduced interior storage and flexibility by removing dashboard nooks and eliminating the 1st gen's multi-adjustable center console. Imagine remodeling your home by removing closets and narrowing the hallway. Typically when you redesign a product, you keep what works and fix what does not. With the 2nd gen, they improved the ride, but they removed the closets and narrowed the hallway. Even though we want a new RL, we don't know if it will suit our needs.
 

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How about doing some further thinking about those that are looking for something more than an SUV, but are not interested in buying a "real" truck, the Ridgeline fits that niche perfectly, does it not? By making some very relatively cheap and basic design changes to their established SUVs, they are essentially expanding their SUV market with the Ridgeline, are they not? By tickling and teasing the fancy of those "real" men who's egos demand their owning a "real" truck, Honda is also adding those to their numbers with the Ridgeline, are they not? The Ridgeline was not conceived to stand alone as a "truck", but rather an extension of Honda's SUV line, for if Honda's goal was really in selling large numbers of "real trucks", then I believe that they would be doing and designing trucks just as you are describing, of which they are totally capable of manufacturing, otherwise.............................................................?

Bill
I've had plenty of time to think about the Ridgeline and have been around here since the get go. I still do plenty of further thinking even now. Perhaps you don't mean to be condescending? Enough of that. . . .

For some perspective, the GenI was indeed created as a truck competitor with a decent budget, unique parts and a talented design team. The GenII is much more of a simple "extension" of the Pilot and there in lies the disappointment for many of us GenI fans.

Turning the Ridgeline into a sales success wouldn't require abandoning the truck-lite person. That's a false assumption. It would require giving it a bit more unique engineering and some visual (inside and out) identity. This means investing money and that means that Honda would need to take it more seriously. The Passport is an example of Honda trying to truck up their image in response to the whims of the market and while it's mostly a shallow aesthetics based treatment it reveals that Honda is well aware of the market potential.

Is it smart for Honda to just dabble or is smart to try and take a bigger stab into the truck market? This is a legitimate question. Do the limits of their current production capacity mean that they shouldn't create a vehicle with greater appeal? That's one staple of the "niche" argument but I would venture to say that it is a recipe for failure. If Honda wants a pickup in their line up (which they sure seem to) why shouldn't they make it a sales success? Given the size of the market and their presence and experience in it for close to 15 years I think they should be ready to up the game.

One final thought is that Honda ought to consider offering softer and more aggressive options. Their competitors are successfully doing just that. How about a hybrid for those who fuel economy is a focus (perhaps at the expense of towing)? Broaden the appeal with more options . . .It would take some effort, $ and guts. It could well pay off.
 

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I've had plenty of time to think about the Ridgeline and have been around here since the get go. I still do plenty of further thinking even now. Perhaps you don't mean to be condescending? Enough of that. . . .

For some perspective, the GenI was indeed created as a truck competitor with a decent budget, unique parts and a talented design team. The GenII is much more of a simple "extension" of the Pilot and there in lies the disappointment for many of us GenI fans.

Turning the Ridgeline into a sales success wouldn't require abandoning the truck-lite person. That's a false assumption. It would require giving it a bit more unique engineering and some visual (inside and out) identity. This means investing money and that means that Honda would need to take it more seriously. The Passport is an example of Honda trying to truck up their image in response to the whims of the market and while it's mostly a shallow aesthetics based treatment it reveals that Honda is well aware of the market potential.

Is it smart for Honda to just dabble or is smart to try and take a bigger stab into the truck market? This is a legitimate question. Do the limits of their current production capacity mean that they shouldn't create a vehicle with greater appeal? That's one staple of the "niche" argument but I would venture to say that it is a recipe for failure. If Honda wants a pickup in their line up (which they sure seem to) why shouldn't they make it a sales success? Given the size of the market and their presence and experience in it for close to 15 years I think they should be ready to up the game.

One final thought is that Honda ought to consider offering softer and more aggressive options. Their competitors are successfully doing just that. How about a hybrid for those who fuel economy is a focus (perhaps at the expense of towing)? Broaden the appeal with more options . . .It would take some effort, $ and guts. It could well pay off.
The Gen 2 is a better truck than the Gen 1. Full stop.
 

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If Honda wants a pickup in their line up (which they sure seem to) why shouldn't they make it a sales success?
Maybe Honda considers the Ridgeline a "sales success". Honda has a history of cult-like following for certain vehicles (eg, Element, CRX, S2000) that they then kill off when sales slump. I think it is too early to say the Ridgeline is not a success.
 

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Maybe Honda considers the Ridgeline a "sales success". Honda has a history of cult-like following for certain vehicles (eg, Element, CRX, S2000) that they then kill off when sales slump. I think it is too early to say the Ridgeline is not a success.
Not much of an endorsement or a business model if you ask me.
 

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Not much of an endorsement or a business model if you ask me.
It's a rather dispassionate business model. I think that Honda addresses the bottom line with no nostalgia for any model where sales fall below their business model. The lost leader is a concept lost on Honda.
 

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Honda is loosing ground to Toyota and others. Their conservativeness and bean counting approach doesn't seem to be working for them.
 

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Im still surprised at the sales numbers. Just under 35k at their peak sold world wide!? That's nothing. But if that's what Honda was shooting for (and i'm sure there's some strategy factored-in) then I guess they can call it a success. Hopefully it's enough success to keep it going...I'd hate to see the line discontinued.
 

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I really do not recall coming across any information about how financially distressed Honda is becoming?

Bill
I don't know about "financially distressed" but sales and market share have declined. They (along with Acura) have also declined in reliability / initial problems with vehicles. In general there are plenty of articles out there suggesting that Honda has lost its "way" and with new leadership are hoping to get back on track.


 

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I am frustrated with my 2018 Ridgeline primarily because the bed is so small. I can't get a cooler in without opening two of three segments of the Honda bed cover. That's because the bed is so shallow. The Honda bed cover is just plain awful. It covers a third of bed unless you remove it, which is not trivial. Plus it's heavy. Very poor design. The storage well under the bed is a gimmick. If you put in something heavy, you'll break your back getting it out. And there's no lock on the tailgate....an egregious omission (you can buy one that works in tandem with the flawed bed cover, but my dealer where service is a zoo knew nothing about it).

The Ridgeline is nice to drive, but honestly, it's not really a truck.

Some of the safety features such as the disclaimer that comes up every time you start the vehicle treats you like an idiot. You have to hit ok like you agree to pay attention to the road to get further functionality from the display. Each time is like interacting with a lawyer. I love the message "steering required." Really?

I gave up my 2011 Silverado and wish I didn't.
It's more of an el camino.
 
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