[OhSix]

Has anyone installed shallow mount sub's in there ridge line..what are the pros and cons if any

Personally, I have no hands-on/real world experience with shallow mount sub woofers, however, there are lots of basic mechanical/acoustic/mathematics at work in a sub woofer system. Emphasis on system because there are so many elements involved in building an effective sub.

There's more pro than con when it comes to shallow mount sub drivers. Here's why: by definition, this type of driver is designed for limited air space inside an enclosure that will fit behind the rear seat of an RL. In that regard, they have mechanical attributes maximizing their performance in small enclosures. *IF* there is a down side to a shallow sub driver, it is "limited" X_MAX which is the specification defining cone excursion. The rough analogy of X_MAX in an internal combustion engine would be stroke of the crank/piston combo. A short stroke by itself might be considered a limiting factor, but there is more at play than that single design element. For example, short stroke of a piston can be compensated for by diameter. So a larger diameter short stroke woofer would be a good thing if it is installed in a properly sized/designed enclosure. I can't say for certain but I'm thinking a 10" is going to be the max diameter for what I suspect you have in mind.

If discussed as a single part of a long list of sub woofer attributes, "short" X_MAX could be perceived as a negative but that is much to simplistic a view of how a component within a system works. A woofer in a box is WAY more than a woofer in a box.

One of the things making sub driver selection "easy" in this category is: there are fewer OEMs playing in this consumer space. So the limited selection makes choice pretty basic. If you are like me, price plays a big role in which driver to choose, and pricing runs from cheap to not-so-cheap. With that in mind, find the driver in your price range, look at enclosure specifications and build an enclosure within those parameters that'll fit the space you have in mind. Easy-peasy.

Here's a couple of examples of whats out there:
http://www.parts-express.com/peerless-835028-10-xls-shallow-subwoofer--264-1105

http://www.parts-express.com/tang-band-w8-2022-8-rbm-subwoofer-8-ohm--264-955

https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.c...b-acoustics-sw26dac76-8-shallow-10-subwoofer/

 

[OhSix]

I hear you Dnick, I have always been into that boomy bass.., I miss my accord which was loud!!! Another question I have, I have a powerbass XA900 class 9 amp,1 channel which is 1 ohms @900 watts,2 ohms @600 watts, and 4 ohms @300 watts..can I get better sub's to produce louder sound for that amp, Or diff amp..

There many variables in the science of human hearing. And when it comes to discussing a persons ability to detect small differences in sound pressure levels, the mathematics behind environmental conditions such as ambient noise, atmospheric pressure (ETC) introduce a universe of data and variable test results.

But all that can be summed up this way: the doubling of power (watts from an amp) produces a ~3db increase in acoustic output (at the speaker). How much louder is a 3db increase? BARELY detectable. By that I mean, environmental conditions would have to be IDEAL in order for the average person with undamaged hearing to detect a 3bd increase in "loudness" at any given frequency.

SO: using the amp you are describing (900W @ 1 ohm vs. 600W @ 2 ohm) *should* produce approx. 1.5db SPL "louder" output into 1 vs 2 ohm loads. You WILL NOT hear that difference, even under laboratory conditions. Throw in the fact that you are driving down the road in a vehicle with a noise floor somewhere around 85db SPL and you are literally talking about NOTHING.

The numbers game played by OEMs of consumer electronics is aptly described as a "game" designed to suck money out of your wallet because most people believe "more is better".

And don't forget, the rated power output of most amps require input power from a vehicle electrical system that may or may not be possible. The specs you quoted are most likely taken @ 14.5VDC which is not a level most vehicles can produce. Throw on top of that the current needed @ 14.5VDC for an amp to produce its rated output and you have a VERY unrealistic group of numbers on your hands.

Best of luck on your boom quest.

 

[OhSix]

I've decided to either go with 1 10" or 1 12" sub..Looking for a sub I can run down to 2 ohms, so my powerbass amp can run it @ 700 watts...Which sub and box should I invest in..I'm not good at building..Looking for that boom

optimus, in effort to keep from getting overly technical, a couple of basic thoughts here.
Most importantly, any amp must be terminated into a load (Ohms) above its minimum rating. As an example, you *could* connect the worlds best 1,500 watt amp to the worlds best 2 ohm speaker system and fry that amp in a hurry if the amp can't handle a 2 ohm load. You MUST make sure an amp is connected to a load that falls within its design parameters or you'll cause it to implode. No matter what power rating you go for, make sure the amp can safely deliver its rated output into the load you connect it to.

As Ian pointed out, speakers can be wired in several ways. Depending on how many speakers are in a circuit and the connection sequence used, you can determine the final "ohms" the amp will see. Let's say you started with 2 4 ohm subs in a box and a mono amp. At your option, those subs could be wired to present 2 ohms or 8 ohms to the amp.

Interestingly, if you were to add 2 more 4 ohm subs, you could wire the 4 subs in a way to present 4 ohms to the amp. This topic could get wordy so if you want to know more, take a look here, you'll definitely learn something.

If I recall, you have a factory head, a "LOC" a good sized amp and 2 10's right now, but you aren't happy with the amount of BOOM you are getting? If that's true, I would suggest you have a wiring issue. Again, we could get technical but I don't think that will help you. I STRONGLY recommend double/triple/quad checking the wiring through out your system. If the set up you have described is not booming your ass right out of the truck, I think there is a speaker wire crossed somewhere in the signal between the head unit, the LOC, the amp outputs or the subs. No matter how big the subs, ANY system can be made to sound "thin" in the low bass range if (for example) the right side speaker wires are connected backwards in relation to the left side.

Here's a 5 minute short cut to try right now: take one sub out, switch the wires. Put it back in. Check that boom. Is it back? You are done. If it still sounds thin or thinner, I'd venture a guess the problem is between the head and the LOC. MAKE SURE R + & - from the head is correctly connected to R + & - to the LOC, and do the same for the L side.

Want an even quicker check? Don't take anything apart, just use the head units balance control to adjust full R then full L. Does the bass sound "better" in either position than it does in the center? If so, you've got a wire crossed somewhere.

EDIT: It is especially important to ensure output the L/R +/- wires between the head and LOC are correct. If these get crossed, big trouble can follow.

Edit 2: These comments assume a sub enclosure suitable for the 2 10" subs in your system.

That system should be bumping your cranial cavity so hard right now that your poor neighbors should be calling the police. I ain't trying to be funny either. Check it man!

BTW and once more: it isn't a matter of opinion, its mathematic fact, in most systems you will NOT hear the difference between an amp rated for 500W vs an amp rated for 1KW. If you are seriously considering replacing the amp you have just to get a few extra watts, I would suggest your money would be MUCH better spent on replacing the factory head.

Carry on...

 

[OhSix]

I had 2 wires backwards on sub box, also my box don't have proper internal volume. The magnet almost touches box, I bought this box 2 years ago off eBay when I 1st got truck, its a down fire box, has 2 inch risers on each end box, I was thinking if I was going to trim the risers off and upfire box, I also have 10" sub spacers I purchased awhile back I could install onto box...

Last couple comments on this:
You found one sub was out of phase of with the other but didn't mention if you heard an improvement after correcting. Did you notice a change for the better when you swapped + & - on one sub?

All by itself, the "issue" of the magnets almost touching the box isn't bad. It's seriously doubtful that is the root of your dissatisfaction, it's equally doubtful extension rings will do much except cause other issues.

There is a significant difference between engineered enclosures with carefully selected sub drivers and off-the-shelf boxes that happen to fit in the space available. Having said that, based on your expectations I'm guessing there won't be a viable turn key solution to ring your bell.

You *could* find a box with a little bit more internal volume but the teeny improvement that might make isn't gonna do what you want.

You mentioned perhaps moving to a single driver enclosure, so for what it's worth, MTX offers a very nice design. You may get lucky and find someone close by with one of these so that you can hear it installed. This is the only solution I'm aware of for the RL with design engineering behind it, everything else is made under the criteria of making something that fits space available. Is this for you? I kinda doubt it. Check it out here

As a final suggestion, its very important to have confidence the polarity of connections between the head unit and LOC are correct. The reason is based in the OEM head using "floating grounds" on the - outputs. Aside from audible issues, if R & L side + & - are not correct, crossed connections can "blow" the internal amp - which may not happen immediately. An easy way to determine if these connections are correct is to check that when balancing full L to full R actually results in sound coming ONLY from the L or R sides. Do that as a final check. IF, when balancing all the way L you still hear sound from the R side, its a safe bet there is a problem between head spk outputs and the LOC.

In short, if everything in your current system is correctly connected, and you need more boom than you are currently getting from the box under the back seat, it may be time to consider removing the back seat altogether. Then you'll have room for a bunch of 15's.

 

[OhSix]

Is there anyone that has heard of fox acoustic boxes..Seems like a nice deal.. Any input on that box..

OK, this really IS the last thought on this: If you spend your dollars on an aftermarket head unit - and choose the right one - you could benefit from a graphic equalizer that would absolutely assist in adjusting the audio quality of your existing sub. The purpose of an equalizer is to compensate for speaker and environmental influences, right now you have only what the OEM head gives you, which generally speaking SUCKS. And, with a new head you could eliminate the LOC (which is certainly limiting audio quality in your system), gain an electronic crossover (giving you even MORE adjustment options) AND have better overall sound than what the OEM head gives you - PLUS all kinds of new ways to connect things like iPods, ETC and maybe even gain handsfree for your cell phone.

I think you are chasing the dragon here. IMO you'd be MUCH better off spending a few hundred bucks on a new head than the same $ on a box and subs. WAY WAY WAY better off all around.

 

[OhSix]

Maybe I will consider that.. I've heard good things about pioneer, JVC double din..I just really need camera input, subvolume control, iPod hook up, maybe around $350-$400 range

You don't need to spend $400 to get everything you need. The "AVH" line of Pioneer heads include powerful software and connection options in the under $300 range. For that price you can have:
Adjustable electronic sub crossover control
Individual speaker level control
iPod input and user interface control
Bluetooth phone connectivity
Front and rear camera inputs.
2V pre-amp out to drive the hell out of any amp.
Ample built in power to drive front and/or rear speakers.
A wide range of display options including customization home screen images and backlight color. Might sound silly but thats a pretty cool feature when you play around with it.

Choosing this kind of option would beat the living snot out of a new sub box in your existing system. Depending on where you purchase, an install and wiring kit can be had for free, making it an even greater value.

Personally, I have the AVH-3700 and even though I have nit-picks, I'm pleased with the sonic quality and software control.

http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_91063_Pioneer-AVH-X3700BHS.html