Honda Ridgeline Owners Club Forums banner

1 - 20 of 60 Posts

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
12,356 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
SYMPTOM
The MIL comes on with DTC P0430 (front bank catalyst system efficiency below threshold [bank 2]). Additionally, one or more of the following DTCs may be stored:
• P030X (misfire)
• P219A (air-fuel ratio variation of cylinder [bank 1, rear bank])
• P219B (air-fuel ratio variation of cylinder [bank 2, front bank])

PROBABLE CAUSE
The PCM software may misinterpret sensor inputs as a deteriorated catalytic converter. Additionally, debris from the fuel injector machining process or high pressure fuel pump can cause internal wear or clogging in the injector.

CORRECTIVE ACTION
• P0430 only: Do the cylinder A/F test. If it fails the test, replace the fuel injectors. If all cylinders pass the test, continue with normal troubleshooting.
• P0430 and any combination of P030X, P219A, or P219B: Replace the fuel injectors.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,820 Posts
Wonder why it doesn't apply to 2017 RLs. I suppose the '17s were machined differently or came from another manufacturer.

Edit: The part number for the injector set changed from 2017 to 2018. I guess that explains it.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
537 Posts
F... This is similar to the issues the 17 had. The fix was a software update followed by eventual replacement of the new part number fuel injectors. Now we see that the new injectors potentially fail to. Seems like overall the GDI system for the Ridgeline in general is crap. Here’s hoping the top tier gas (all those detergent additives) truly can prevent this issues across all years.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
12,356 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
Here’s hoping the top tier gas (all those detergent additives) truly can prevent this issues across all years.
All the Top Tier gasoline, additives, and fuel system cleaners in the world won't dissolve metal shavings. :)

"PROBABLE CAUSE
The PCM software may misinterpret sensor inputs as a deteriorated catalytic converter. Additionally, debris from the fuel injector machining process or high pressure fuel pump can cause internal wear or clogging in the injector."
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
46 Posts
Just got my 17 back yesterday with this fix. Had p0430 and they replaced the injectors. I assume they didn’t need to do the update as this truck has been in the shop for so many other issues at this point.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
12,356 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Wonder why it doesn't apply to 2017 RLs. I suppose the '17s were machined differently or came from another manufacturer.

Edit: The part number for the injector set changed from 2017 to 2018. I guess that explains it.
Just got my 17 back yesterday with this fix. Had p0430 and they replaced the injectors. I assume they didn’t need to do the update as this truck has been in the shop for so many other issues at this point.
Different TSB's for these issues apply to the 2017 Ridgeline.

TSB 17-036 addresses an issue where "the PCM software may misinterpret sensor inputs as a deteriorated catalytic converter" resulting in a MIL with DTC P0430. The corrective action is a software update only.

TSB 18-025 addresses an issue with "debris from the high pressure pump or the fuel injector machining process can cause internal wear or clogging inside the injector" resulting in a MIL with DTC's P0301-P0306 or P219A/B. The corrective action is to replace the fuel injectors only.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,820 Posts
Different TSB's for these issues apply to the 2017 Ridgeline.

TSB 17-036 addresses an issue where "the PCM software may misinterpret sensor inputs as a deteriorated catalytic converter" resulting in a MIL with DTC P0430. The corrective action is a software update only.

TSB 18-025 addresses an issue with "debris from the high pressure pump or the fuel injector machining process can cause internal wear or clogging inside the injector" resulting in a MIL with DTC's P0301-P0306 or P219A/B. The corrective action is to replace the fuel injectors only.
Yes, I had the update done. It appears that the 2017 TSB only requires the software update where the 2018 requires replacement of the injectors.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
12,356 Posts
Discussion Starter #9 (Edited)
Yes, I had the update done. It appears that the 2017 TSB only requires the software update where the 2018 requires replacement of the injectors.
It depends on year and code(s). Based on the TSB's:
  • If a 2017 has a code P0430, it needs a software update.
  • If a 2017-2018 has codes P0301-P0306 or P219A/B, it needs new injectors.
  • If a 2018-2019 has code P0430, a test must be performed to determine if it needs new injectors or if further troubleshooting is necessary to diagnose the cause of the P0430 such as a catalytic converter that has actually failed instead of the PCM thinking it failed due to a "misinterpretation of sensor inputs" since the 2018-2019 already have the updated software.
  • If a 2018-2019 has codes P0301-P0306 or P219A/B, it needs new injectors.
These three TSB's cover two separate issues:

1) Software that causes a "false" P0430 even though no components have failed.

2) Wear or clogging of the injectors due to manufacturing debris.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,820 Posts
It depends on year and code(s). Based on the TSB's:
  • If a 2017 has a code P0430, it needs a software update.
  • If a 2017-2018 has codes P0301-P0306 or P219A/B, it needs new injectors.
  • If a 2018-2019 has code P0430, a test must be performed to determine if it needs new injectors or if further troubleshooting is necessary to diagnose the cause of the P0430 such as a catalytic converter that has actually failed instead of the PCM thinking it failed due to a "misinterpretation of sensor inputs" since the 2018-2019 already have the updated software.
  • If a 2018-2019 has codes P0301-P0306 or P219A/B, it needs new injectors.
These three TSB's cover two separate issues:

1) Software that causes a "false" P0430 even though no components have failed.

2) Wear or clogging of the injectors due to manufacturing debris.
I suppose I didn't read the TSB closely enough. I had the 2017 TSB for the software update performed (just in case). I haven't had any issues or any codes. I may have just jinxed myself.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
12,356 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
I suppose I didn't read the TSB closely enough. I had the 2017 TSB for the software update performed (just in case). I haven't had any issues or any codes. I may have just jinxed myself.
Haha! Let's hope not!

Since you had the software update per TSB 17-036 done, you shouldn't have to worry about getting a "false" P0430 code. However, you could still get codes P0301-P0306 or P219A/B if your injectors clog or wear prematurely. There's no way I know of to predict or prevent that from happening aside from proactively replacing the injectors. Based on the affected VIN's, it appears Honda corrected the clogging/wear due to debris issue about halfway through 2019 production.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
740 Posts
Based on the affected VIN's, it appears Honda corrected the clogging/wear due to debris issue about halfway through 2019 production.
Yeah, glad to note my 10/2018 build 2019 AWD is 'unaffected' (knocking on wood as I type that).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,820 Posts
Haha! Let's hope not!

Since you had the software update per TSB 17-036 done, you shouldn't have to worry about getting a "false" P0430 code. However, you could still get codes P0301-P0306 or P219A/B if your injectors clog or wear prematurely. There's no way I know of to predict or prevent that from happening aside from proactively replacing the injectors. Based on the affected VIN's, it appears Honda corrected the clogging/wear due to debris issue about halfway through 2019 production.
Yes, and I'm hoping that, if it occurs, it will be before the powertrain warranty is up. I'm close to owning my RL for three years so the basic warranty is almost over. I've read about some instances where the dealership has claimed that injectors are not part of the powertrain. I have a very good relationship with my dealership, so I'm hoping that won't be the case if my RL is affected. Looks like just the parts would run about $2k if I had to purchase them myself.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
437 Posts
This one includes the 2017:
 

Attachments

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
537 Posts
All the Top Tier gasoline, additives, and fuel system cleaners in the world won't dissolve metal shavings. :)

"PROBABLE CAUSE
The PCM software may misinterpret sensor inputs as a deteriorated catalytic converter. Additionally, debris from the fuel injector machining process or high pressure fuel pump can cause internal wear or clogging in the injector."
Copy, good point. That being said many people who received the P0430 code had the software update on their 17 followed by injector replacements. What was the cause of failure for those? Carbon buildup from a poor design?
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
12,356 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Yes, and I'm hoping that, if it occurs, it will be before the powertrain warranty is up. I'm close to owning my RL for three years so the basic warranty is almost over. I've read about some instances where the dealership has claimed that injectors are not part of the powertrain. I have a very good relationship with my dealership, so I'm hoping that won't be the case if my RL is affected. Looks like just the parts would run about $2k if I had to purchase them myself.
I strongly doubt any dealer will eat $2,000 worth of parts no matter how good you feel your relationship is with them. The best chance in that scenario would be if your dealer has a good enough relationship with Honda to convince them to approve a goodwill repair.

Honda is clear in the Warranty Booklet that fuel injectors are covered for 3/36 (or 4/48 for Certified Pre-Owned) except in California, Connecticut, Delaware, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Jersey, New York, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, Vermont, and Washington where they are covered for 7/70. The Honda Care warranty also covers fuel injectors for up to 8/120.

Copy, good point. That being said many people who received the P0430 code had the software update on their 17 followed by injector replacements. What was the cause of failure for those? Carbon buildup from a poor design?
Probably "debris from the high pressure pump or the fuel injector machining process". For those who have noticed apparent carbon buildup on the tips of the injectors, I highly doubt this is the primary cause of injector failure. The more likely explanation is that injector failure due to machining debris caused the carbon build-up.

This one includes the 2017:
Thank you. I missed that one. It replaces TSB 17-036.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,820 Posts
I strongly doubt any dealer will eat $2,000 worth of parts no matter how good you feel your relationship is with them. The best chance in that scenario would be if your dealer has a good enough relationship with Honda to convince them to approve a goodwill repair.

Honda is clear in the Warranty Booklet that fuel injectors are covered for 3/36 (or 4/48 for Certified Pre-Owned) except in California, Connecticut, Delaware, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Jersey, New York, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, Vermont, and Washington where they are covered for 7/70. The Honda Care warranty also covers fuel injectors for up to 8/120.
I've noticed that Standard makes aftermarket fuel injectors for the 2017s now. Most places are sold out. I wonder why. :rolleyes:
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
12,356 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
FWIW, Honda sells injectors for DI engines only as a complete, flow-matched set. They do not sell them individually. Even if only one injector is faulty, dealers are instructed to replace all six injectors. Replacing them individually introduces the potential for cylinder imbalance on DI engines.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,820 Posts
FWIW, Honda sells injectors for DI engines only as a complete, flow-matched set. They do not sell them individually. Even if only one injector is faulty, dealers are instructed to replace all six injectors. Replacing them individually introduces the potential for cylinder imbalance on DI engines.
Yes, and they also replace everything else it seems. This set isn't much more than Rock Auto.

https://www.hondapartsonline.net/v-2017-honda-ridgeline-sedan--black--6-speed-automatic/engine--fuel-injector
 
1 - 20 of 60 Posts
Top