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I sympathize with Ford, Hyundai, and those interested in the Maverick and Santa Cruz because they're going through what Honda and the Ridgeline have been through for 16 years.

If the Maverick outsells the Ridgeline, I'll bet it'll be because of fleet sales or Ford loyalists who need to replace their Fiestas and Focuses with a vehicle in the same price range that just happens to have a (small) open bed.

If the Santa Cruz outsells the Ridgeline, I'll bet it'll be because...well...I'd be very surprised if it does - the exterior styling is even more unconventional than the Ridgeline's and we all know how averse "real truck" buyers are to anything that doesn't have the same shape as the one their dads and granddads had.
 
On sales it will eat the RL for sure.
Capabilities?
The only thing that is superior is the max weight that the bed of the maverick can hold.
1,100lb vs 1500lb

The problem is that the maverick payload is rated to 1,500lb too, so that max bed weight capacity doesn't mean too much anyway.
On the sales aspect, most of us aren't Honda salespeople, so it's OK if they sell a billion Mavericks. A lot more conventional trucks are sold than the Ridgeline (Captain Obvious here, lol), to some extent because consumers tend to be conformists, not logically looking at alternatives. Hopefully the Maverick will be a great truck; a competitor that drives Honda and other mfgs to improve their products/value packages.
 
I sympathize with Ford, Hyundai, and those interested in the Maverick and Santa Cruz because they're going through what Honda and the Ridgeline have been through for 16 years.

If the Maverick outsells the Ridgeline, I'll bet it'll be because of fleet sales or Ford loyalists who need to replace their Fiestas and Focuses with a vehicle in the same price range that just happens to have a (small) open bed.

If the Santa Cruz outsells the Ridgeline, I'll bet it'll be because...well...I'd be very surprised if it does - the exterior styling is even more unconventional than the Ridgeline's and we all know how averse "real truck" buyers are to anything that doesn't have the same shape as the one their dads and granddads had.
First, we need to assume that both manufacturers will build to meet demand.

Second, it will depend on who does the best marketing*.

* As enthusiastic as some of us are, I believe the vast majority of vehicle buyers have very little knowledge of what's available on the market and what will meet their wants and needs.
 
I sympathize with Ford, Hyundai, and those interested in the Maverick and Santa Cruz because they're going through what Honda and the Ridgeline have been through for 16 years.

If the Maverick outsells the Ridgeline, I'll bet it'll be because of fleet sales or Ford loyalists who need to replace their Fiestas and Focuses with a vehicle in the same price range that just happens to have a (small) open bed.

If the Santa Cruz outsells the Ridgeline, I'll bet it'll be because...well...I'd be very surprised if it does - the exterior styling is even more unconventional than the Ridgeline's and we all know how averse "real truck" buyers are to anything that doesn't have the same shape as the one their dads and granddads had.
I think you pointed it out before Hyundai isnt trying to sell the SC to Truck buyers, but i think they priced it way too high if they are really aiming at that demographic, Truck owners are used to paying 10K premiums for a bed and 4WD but most car owners are not, if its priced almost the same as a RL i would never really consider buying it, but if its 10K LESS for the exact same features they are offering right now i think it would be bad for RL sales

also completely off topic, but seeing an AD for a RL on this site is pretty hilarious, gotta love those "algorithms":LOL:
 
I sympathize with Ford, Hyundai, and those interested in the Maverick and Santa Cruz because they're going through what Honda and the Ridgeline have been through for 16 years.

If the Maverick outsells the Ridgeline, I'll bet it'll be because of fleet sales or Ford loyalists who need to replace their Fiestas and Focuses with a vehicle in the same price range that just happens to have a (small) open bed.

If the Santa Cruz outsells the Ridgeline, I'll bet it'll be because...well...I'd be very surprised if it does - the exterior styling is even more unconventional than the Ridgeline's and we all know how averse "real truck" buyers are to anything that doesn't have the same shape as the one their dads and granddads had.
I don't know about those fleet sales on the Maverick. I see a lot more Transit Connect vans (or similar) around now than small trucks for businesses. I am guessing those businesses that would have purchased a small truck with a cap see more value in just getting the small van now. I'd also guess they like the added bonus of the huge side panel to also plaster their business name on too. I'd think they would say, why bother with the small Maverick when I can get more secure space with a small van, but those are just my unscientific guesses.

I don't think fleet managers are all that immune to the "tough truck" marketing either; Even if the choice is between the Maverick and Ranger.
 
I don't know about those fleet sales on the Maverick. I see a lot more Transit Connect vans (or similar) around now than small trucks for businesses.
Perhaps that's because the Transit Connect is the second least-expensive Ford model. Only the smaller EcoSport is less expensive. The Maverick is priced even lower than the EcoSport making it the least expensive Ford model you can buy and about $5K cheaper than the Transit Connect.
 
Perhaps that's because the Transit Connect is the second least-expensive Ford model. Only the smaller EcoSport is less expensive. The Maverick is priced even lower than the EcoSport making it the least expensive Ford model you can buy and about $5K cheaper than the Transit Connect.
I also think the hybrid would be attractive to fleets that run a lot of short city runs, maybe NAPA parts runners or Orkin workers.

That is assuming Ford will sell hybrids to the fleets, since they think hybrids will have a small take rate. I would bet that if they do sell the hybrid to fleets, there won't be much gap for fleet pricing. I suspect that $20k number is on the verge of being a loss leader and could easily tip into bigger losses depending on market demands and supply issues.
 
Not sure if it's been posted above, but here's the Dave Demuro review. TLDR; version: he likes it reasonably well (exterior > interior), thinks it drives very well, but thinks it will tank in the marketplace.

I am not sure I agree. I think the demand for smaller trucks is so high it will do well at least for a year or 2.

One quibble is that he states the starting price of the RL is $39K, which is not true--it's $36,500. He does correctly point out that the 2 are not really comparable--like comparing a loaded Accord with a base Civic.

His Santa Cruz as tested was in the upper $40's IIRC.

 
I've had around eight or nine Hyundai cars/suv's and never had a problem with any of them, even the dual clutch tranny worked fine. I suspect the Santa Cruz will have a fairly roomy front seat, I fit in my wife's Kona just fine, and it's smaller. I really think this thing is a little too small to be practical for any use, and standard front wheel drive is not a good idea for towing anything. Imagine just a jet ski on a boat ramp? I will say the quality should be great, at least as good as ours. But they are keeping a dark secret about performance (IMO), and it doesn't get any better mileage than us.
 
The pricing in Canada for Ridgeline vs Maverick vs Santa Cruz is interesting. I have an RL EX-L, price for a new one $48,500Cdn. To get equivalent specs (AWD, leather, biggest engine, safety features) for SC (Preferred Trend trim) is $41,300. For Maverick Lariat with luxury pkg is also about $41,300. The supposed price advantage of Maverick disappears at these trim levels. But a $7+k savings for SC is fairly compelling, especially if better warranty. I’m not trading my Ridgeline anytime soon (except possibly for a Lightning) but an interesting comparison for us Canadians.
 
I think the SC tech is way better than Honda product tech. No competition, SC warranty is way better. SC ground clearance, RL loses there also. Leg room, exactly the same. Bed size goes to the RL but SC offers a secure rear bed storage system that many here drop 1k or more to do the same. Ride, SC likely better. It’s just a lighter more nimble vehicle. Engine and trans, no doubt the SC wins that. 0-60 likely close. Quality, SC all the way, Hyundai crushes Honda on JD Power initial quality. Sound system, SC no way loses there either. Resale, RL will crush it. AWD, don’t be surprised but I bet its a draw. Rear window, RL has that. SC win with a shifter and center console. SC for the money has more features, no contest. Seating width, RL wins that. Looks, subjective, no doubt SC has an edge. Honda blew that with this model. I doubt anyone here loads the cooler with ice, but RL wins that and trunk size. Easier to haul big stuff, RL. Price paid OTD, SC gonna win that, Honda won’t budge. Uniqueness and cool factor, SC is gonna get that. SC will appeal to young buyers, RL will appeal to old buyers. Just look at this forum and who buys RLs. Interior quietness, likely RL gets that. Better options at lower trims, I think SC gets that too. Obviously if we talk lower power base engine, this debate changes. I was sticking with comparably equipped and priced. Truck qualities, RL likely barely eeks it out.
 
First week bud. RL was same. Give it a few months to calm down. That said Telluride is 10k over in many places still, so no guarantee. This current condition won’t last. 3500 off is doable most of the time.
 
I think the SC tech is way better than Honda product tech. No competition, SC warranty is way better. SC ground clearance, RL loses there also. Leg room, exactly the same. Bed size goes to the RL but SC offers a secure rear bed storage system that many here drop 1k or more to do the same. Ride, SC likely better. It’s just a lighter more nimble vehicle. Engine and trans, no doubt the SC wins that. 0-60 likely close. Quality, SC all the way, Hyundai crushes Honda on JD Power initial quality. Sound system, SC no way loses there either. Resale, RL will crush it. AWD, don’t be surprised but I bet its a draw. Rear window, RL has that. SC win with a shifter and center console. SC for the money has more features, no contest. Seating width, RL wins that. Looks, subjective, no doubt SC has an edge. Honda blew that with this model. I doubt anyone here loads the cooler with ice, but RL wins that and trunk size. Easier to haul big stuff, RL. Price paid OTD, SC gonna win that, Honda won’t budge. Uniqueness and cool factor, SC is gonna get that. SC will appeal to young buyers, RL will appeal to old buyers. Just look at this forum and who buys RLs. Interior quietness, likely RL gets that. Better options at lower trims, I think SC gets that too. Obviously if we talk lower power base engine, this debate changes. I was sticking with comparably equipped and priced. Truck qualities, RL likely barely eeks it out.
Dave Demuro says the SC drives very well “like a crossover”, but the Ridgeline has an excellent ride—definitely the best in its size.

Payload capacity similar.

Towing capacity is the same on paper, but I am extremely dubious the towing of the Santa Cruz will live up to the billing or match the Ridgeline. Plus there are advantages to towing with a larger vehicle regardless of horsepower.

The Ridgeline has a tried-and-true and refined transmission. The Santa Cruz transmission reliability remains to be seen.

The big difference is bed size. The extra foot and a half length in the Ridgeline is a big deal. In fact, it’s the main reason I wouldn’t consider a Santa Cruz even assuming the towing and hauling numbers are legit.

We pull a camper and load up the bed with 2 ebikes, as well as a cooler and grill. That just wouldn’t be possible with the Santa Cruz.
 
Agree, the SC is likely the “truck” most city people need. For that stuff you mention, it’s the wrong tool. SC is for mowers, bikes, mulch. Small trailer. Fun, not work. SC ride will be better than RL. For the record the RL trans sucks. Sold my TLX after 6 months. The 10 speed is good, the dogbone 9 is terrible. Dual clutch is gonna feel racy. I said years ago the RL needed to be on the sport side, not truck Side. They can’t win on the truck side, they could on the sport truck side but chose to blow it. Imagine a Type R truck.
 
Agree, the SC is likely the “truck” most city people need. For that stuff you mention, it’s the wrong tool. SC is for mowers, bikes, mulch. Small trailer. Fun, not work. SC ride will be better than RL. For the record the RL trans sucks. Sold my TLX after 6 months. The 10 speed is good, the dogbone 9 is terrible. Dual clutch is gonna feel racy. I said years ago the RL needed to be on the sport side, not truck Side. They can’t win on the truck side, they could on the sport truck side but chose to blow it. Imagine a Type R truck.
yet if you listen just to the loud ones on here the RL needs an entire offroad package more than anything else, but i would prefer the sport option as well, im still pretty split between the two SC and RL, we also own a hyundai elantra and i really like that but i prefer to drive my RL when i have to upgrade i will probably be choosing between a used RL or a used SC, and i will probably buy whatever i can afford, i do like the RL is standard AWD, that and a bed are all i really want in a vehicle
 
I think the SC tech is way better than Honda product tech. No competition, SC warranty is way better. SC ground clearance, RL loses there also. Leg room, exactly the same. Bed size goes to the RL but SC offers a secure rear bed storage system that many here drop 1k or more to do the same. Ride, SC likely better. It’s just a lighter more nimble vehicle. Engine and trans, no doubt the SC wins that. 0-60 likely close. Quality, SC all the way, Hyundai crushes Honda on JD Power initial quality. Sound system, SC no way loses there either. Resale, RL will crush it. AWD, don’t be surprised but I bet its a draw. Rear window, RL has that. SC win with a shifter and center console. SC for the money has more features, no contest. Seating width, RL wins that. Looks, subjective, no doubt SC has an edge. Honda blew that with this model. I doubt anyone here loads the cooler with ice, but RL wins that and trunk size. Easier to haul big stuff, RL. Price paid OTD, SC gonna win that, Honda won’t budge. Uniqueness and cool factor, SC is gonna get that. SC will appeal to young buyers, RL will appeal to old buyers. Just look at this forum and who buys RLs. Interior quietness, likely RL gets that. Better options at lower trims, I think SC gets that too. Obviously if we talk lower power base engine, this debate changes. I was sticking with comparably equipped and priced. Truck qualities, RL likely barely eeks it out.
Here's my opinion..and it's just my opinion.

Tech - Who cares...before the vehicle is paid for it will be obsolete. Just give me a two knob radio and bluetooth and I'm happy
Ground clearance - Who cares...I think the biggest obstacle I take my Ridgeline over is the 2" lip of concrete I have to drive over to get into my garage. I do take it off road though...my driveway is gravel...LOL! I did ford a river in my 2019 RL. It did just fine.
Leg Room - Ridgeline has plenty for my 36" inseam. No complaints.
Bed Size - The Ridgeline is BARELY adequate for hauling my motorcycle. Any shorter and I'd be out of luck...so that lone fact removes the SC from my shopping list
Ride - The Ridgeline is pretty dang good. I'd be surprised if the SC could do a lot better
Engine - Give me a smooth, proven, Honda V6 over a turbo 4 popper any day. Turbos get heat soaked and are prone to pull back timing, but they do work well at high altitude.
Quality - I've heard horror stories about both Honda and Hyundai. I've also heard great things. I think it's probably a draw today, but in the past Honda has made vastly superior vehicles.
Sound System - Who cares. No factory audio system south of something found in a ultra high end luxury car is very good. I'd rather them just leave it out and let me go aftermarket.
Resale - I don't think I've ever bought a vehicle with resale in mind, but I from what I've seen, Honda's hold their resale value extremely well.
AWD - The Honda AWD system is one of the best made. It's an amazing system. I have no experience with the Hyundai AWD system so I can't comment on it.
Rear Window - Yep...both trucks have a rear window which allows light to pass through so you can see out of it. Works great
Shifter - Ridgeline hands down is better here. Why in the heck do you want a big pole sticking out of your console on an automatic trans car? I get tired of banging my drinks into it.
Features - Let's see...engine, doors, tires, transmission, seats, door locks, gauges...both have them. Everything else is just crap to break and useless stuff I don't want or need.
Seating - Ridgeline Sport seats in my truck are just fine. They hold my butt off the floor and thankfully they are manually adjustable so I don't have to listen to "wurrrrrrrrrr" for 15 seconds as I move my seat back after my wife or daughter drive the truck.
Looks - Function before form...I wouldn't care if either truck was a completely square box and painted pink and purple. If it runs and drives good, is comfortable, reliable, and meets my needs...I'm happy
Trunk - Best feature on the Ridgeline is the tailgate and trunk. SC tried to copy it...a swing and a miss.
Hauling - Ridgeline hauls more by virtue of it's larger bed
Price - I paid $28k for my 2019 Sport that stickered for $34k and I paid $34k for my 2021 that stickered for $36k during the middle of an inventory shortage. So I'd say Honda "budges"
Cool Factor - They are both unibody trucks. They aren't cool.
Young Buyers - I'm almost 50 I have no idea what young buyers want. When they grow up they'll realize buying cars will keep your broke and they'll be pumping money into retirement and college funds for their kids until they get in their 60's and buy a Corvette or 911. LOL!
Quietness - Having never driven a SC...I can't comment here
Lower Trim Options - I don't know about the SC..but I priced out comparable midsize trucks with what comes standard on the RL Sport and they were all MUCH more expensive. The Sport trim is the value proposition for the Ridgeline

The advantage the Santa Cruz has over the Ridgeline is the fact that Hyundai went the direction Honda should have gone. Stop trying to compete with trucks and target the huge market for people who want a truck but don't like trucks. My wife would NEVER own a truck. But when she drove my Ridgeline she loved it. She even said, "If I'd have known it was this easy to drive I might have gotten one myself". Hey Honda...STOP TRYING TO COMPETE WITH REGULAR OLD TRUCKS! Use the features that make you unique to show why you're BETTER than a "real truck". That's what Hyundai is doing with their design language. It doesn't look like a truck...and that's on purpose. There is a reason Steve Jobs made the iPod and not just another Walkman. He created a market. He's quoted as saying something similar to, "People don't know what they want until I tell them" or something like that. Same with these new crop of trucks.
 
Thanks for keeping it real. Regardless of opinions, the real winner is the consumer because competition leads to better products. While I could never get that level of deal on a RL around here where I live, good for you. You are the typical non car person Honda buyer/lover. Your apathy for all those items is why Honda exists. This is not meant to be derogatory, simply stating that most Honda customers don’t care about much other than it’s a Honda.
 
Thanks for keeping it real. Regardless of opinions, the real winner is the consumer because competition leads to better products. While I could never get that level of deal on a RL around here where I live, good for you. You are the typical non car person Honda buyer/lover. Your apathy for all those items is why Honda exists. This is not meant to be derogatory, simply stating that most Honda customers don’t care about much other than it’s a Honda.
I would disagree on the "typical honda customer" comment, at least i can tell you the people on here are the most informed group of car buyers i have ever known. I consider myself a car person and i dont care about a lot of features because that means i can get more usability/ reliability/ fun for my money if i settle for fewer features. I love talking about all the new features but i put very little value in anything that isnt one of the 3 things i listed before, for my money honda offers some of the best deals for my needs.

also for reference i think im a "young buyer" at 30
 
Dave Demuro says the SC drives very well “like a crossover”, but the Ridgeline has an excellent ride—definitely the best in its size.
Payload capacity similar.
The big difference is bed size. The extra foot and a half length in the Ridgeline is a big deal.
Alex on Autos said the SC had a better ride than the Ridgeline - go figure.

The payload capacities are similar, but how much gear, etc can you really even get into the small bed of the SC?
 
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